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building a computer for 500

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by ghettowhiteboy, Jun 6, 2008.

  1. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    I'm trying to build the best gaming rig i can for $500. i can upgrade parts later but right now it can't go over 500.

    what i've got sofar is

    MOBO http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161203
    CPU http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103228
    VID http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161203
    POWER http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817170010
    HDD http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136113
    CASE (got a few laying around)
    OPTICAL DRIVE (have a temporary CD-ROM but will eventually upgrade to cd dvd +/- DL RW and possably a blueray reader
    RAM (will probably get a couple bars off ebay for $50 and later upgrade to a couple more)
    OS XP sp2 (bittorrent)
    KEYBOARD/MOUSE/MONITOR (got way too many of them laying around)
    WiFi (wally world $20)
    AUDIO 4.1 surround

    Eventually I want to add a tv tuner, upgrade to a lcd tv, and get a bluetooth headset and dongle.

    Does anyone know of better deals or anything wrong with my selections? I'd like to know before I blow $500 and get crap.(and don't even suggest vista I hate that OS). also as you can probably tell my preference is amd/ati(ati only cause it's made by amd and therefore works better with it). my opinion on intel is the old cpu's couldn't keep up and the new ones cost too much. besides the most reliable pc i ever used ran an amd deron 1ghz and i've yet to see it give me any kind of problems whatsoever.
     
  2. akhilles

    akhilles First Sergeant

  3. EEEEDIOT

    EEEEDIOT Specialist

    You can go for something like this. I like this video
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=DWUo8kkmRHE

    It's basically a video for setting up a budget gaming system. It's $600, but you should be able to trim it down with similar parts.

    Also, you probably shouldn't mention "bittorrent" because the mods and don't like it, unless you have a legit cd-key and such.
     
  4. Fred_G

    Fred_G Heat packin' geek

    How about something like this:
    CPU $184 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115028
    Mobo $89 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128337
    PSU $84 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341010
    RAM $37 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231044
    H Drive $59 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148262
    GPU $???

    Total $453.00 plus a few bucks shipping. You would have to pick out a video card. For around $550 you should be able to get something decent. I see you want AMD, and it needs to be $500 total. Just a suggestion...

    E
     
  5. dlb

    dlb MajorGeek

    The OPs motherboard link and video card link are the same.... as stated above, I'd go with a cheaper CPU and spend the saving on a better video card. The AMD X2 5400+ is good chip and about $40 less than the the one chosen by the OP. Also, the PSU chosen might be attractive for the price, but Logisys can be real hit or miss. Some motherboards are not compatible with Logisys PSUs. I know it sounds weird, but it has something to do with the 5vSB line on the power supply not putting out enough amps which prevents some motherboards from powering up. Bedsides, a $25 power supply is... well.... it's a $25 power supply. Don't expect much. If you can't afford a stronger unit, at least go with a name brand unit. There is something that I just have to comment on:
    Having a prefernce is cool, I like AMD processors too; great value and 'bang for the buck'. But saying that ATI is made by AMD and therefore they work together better is ridiculous. ATI is not made by AMD. AMD and ATI joined together. ATI is still ATI and made by ATI. It's like saying that a movie was made by the Coca-Cola company becuase Columbia Pictures is a sister company of Coca-Cola. ATI products (and Nvidia products) are designed to be compatible with a wide range of components, and are not designed to 'work better' with one brand or another. I used to think that running an ATI video card on a motherboard with an NVidia chipset would cause problems. Duh. It doesn't. I currently run an NVidia card on a motherboard with an AMD chipset and AMD processor; it works great. Actually, my PC rocks. And is totally stable. So- one brand doesn't necessarily work better with another just because they two companies might have the same board of directors. OK- Enough of that. Advertising that you plan on using a pirated, bootlegged, illegal operating system isn't really the smartest thing ever. Neither is using it. You may have trouble getting updates and if you need Microsoft's support for anything (and eventually you will), you'll be out of luck.
     
  6. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    I never said I didn't. I have a few legit keys for xp home, 1 for pro and i think 2 for 2k pro, but why buy windows cds when you can make them cheaper?

    ok, how's this?

    cpu $66 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103258
    the only reason for the 6600 was my stepdad just bought an hp with a 6000 in it(but vista'll bog it down enough so it can't compete /w mine)
    mobo $87 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138105
    after reading the reviews on the other one i decided to pick another one.
    gpu $107 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161203
    that's the link i meant to post
    ram $44 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231044
    thanx fred_g

    also i just had a thought, would it be worth it to upgrade to a 64 bit os(which i do not have a legit key for yet)? last thing i heard was 3rd party firewalls and some anti virus were crashing with xp pro 64.
    and the power supply, is it a good idea to get a small one for the 24 pin and sata connectors? and use an old 250 or 300 i have to power the rest? I've not yet had a problem with power supplies ever.
     
  7. Fred_G

    Fred_G Heat packin' geek

    Looks pretty good if you want to stick with AMD. I have to ask, what PSU? You do know that is the only component that can fail and take out your whole rig...
    I only have experience with 32 bit win XP. Like it, may upgrade the OS next year.

    E
     
  8. ibbonkers

    ibbonkers Sergeant Major

  9. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Wow no offense but "my preference is amd/ati(ati only cause it's made by amd and therefore works better with it)" just ripped out 50% of the market and without any technically sound reason. In fact current decent technical reviews indicate that AMD is behind the 8 ball for processors and their up and coming products aren't quite cutting the grade. Any serious gamer wouldn't care if it was either AMD or Intel powering the system as long as they were getting kick arse performance! Will leave it at that. Basically Intel is rocking with the Core 2 Duos (Dual and Quad) and there 8 cores are coming out but I am yet to find a "positive" technical review about the latest AMD. nVidia is better for gaming "slightly" but ATI is better for HDTV (has HDMI so sound is a lot better from what I'm reading without complex additions to the Video Card).

    The PSU you list does not have a PCI-e plug and therefore wont power the Video Card!

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817170010

    but this one does:

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817170017

    Couldn't agree more the PSU "You do know that is the only component that can fail and take out your whole rig... ". So you should spend a little extra there "making sure it has a PCI-e jack" and is a "good brand".

    Some Video Cards that are better than what you listed are:

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814103051

    The Diamond Viper gets some kick arse reviews!

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150278

    Both the ATI and nVidia are a lot better than what you have and any less than either of these "series" and you will be playing at mid to low settings on any current games, e.g. AoC, Crysis, etc etc.

    If you want to get serious and consider an Intel build I will help but you have to remove the blinkers. Do some reading and you may see what I mean.
     
  10. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    I'll go with changing the psu, and the gpu, although i don't see how for 8 stream processors that nvidia can beat twice the clock speed in both the gpu and ram of the ati i origanaly picked. the ati card you pointed out seems like alot more bang for only $20 dif. also still stickin with amd. the intell cpu with a comperable price to the amd i picked is http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116052

    pros? i heard a while ago intel has a deal with microsoft, so they may work better together
    cons? 80% the clock speed, bout 40% the fsb, no hyper threading, no virtualization Technology....

    oh yea and not only did the 1 ghz duron kick ***(and still does), so did my and k6, infact i've only had one intel run decent and that was a 533 p2 and only when i put ubutu on it, i disliked my 1.2 cel(too slow, i blame it on fsb), 800 p3, and 66 486 both running well then locking up if i leave em on too long.

    Maybe intel has gotten better, maybe they run reliably for long periods of time now, and maybe they can game without crashing or locking up, but prise to perfomance ratio i like amd, besides from past experience i've never had trouble.
     
  11. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Well historically AMD did rule the roost for "gaming" systems and performance but today Intel has the market (for the time being) and into the near future from what I'm reading. I don't care either way myself and I wouldn't base any decisions on historical data. My current Q6600 is running from 2.4GHz to 3.0GHz on air (CNPS9500) without a hitch with CPU temps of 27-29C!

    You could get a dual core until the quad cores come down in price just a suggestion, my old 805D was running from 2.66GHz to 3.4 on air without a problem.

    Would really ensure the MOBO and CPU (which both seem they can) will work in a 64Bit environment as imho 64Bit will be the OS of choice within 12 months and serious games will start to take advantage of this.
     
  12. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    I don't fully understand it either excepting to say that I wouldn't base a decision on "stream processors" as nVidia apparently uses them a "lot" more efficiently and therefore doesn't need the same amount of stream processors for comparable outcomes. Research will highlight those differences. It is hard to directly compare Intel and AMD on "physical components" alone as they work on differing principles/architectures and therefore instruction sets, same with ATI and nVidia.
     
  13. dlb

    dlb MajorGeek

    :confused roflmao
    Again, totally ridiculous. What's with this whole "they work better together" line of thinking? I heard Taco Bell and Pepsi are the same company, so I can't drink root beer with my burrito.
    I'll say it again: all hardware and software is designed to be as compatible and interchangeable as possible as to increase it's marketability. You can't sell something if it won't run well with a certain 'brand'. So, get over it. You're basically saying that Windows (and all Microsoft software) runs better with Intel products than anything else. I'm sorry, but this has got to be one of most 'out there' things I've heard in a while. I'm sorry, I don't mean to flame or rant, but this is.... never mind.... I'm done.
     
  14. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    maybe i worded it wrong, i meant maybe windows takes better advantage of intels strongpoints or features and intel may be designed to take advantage of the features windows offers better. but w/e
     
  15. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    i dont quite get it, are you saying that basicaly an nvidia is comperable to an ati of double clock speed, kinda like amds were the equivalent of 2-4 times the clock speed of an intel?
     
  16. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    All I'm going to say if you look at both of these links and head to the bottom of the tables that the GeForce 9800 GTX is comparable to the Radeon HD 3870 even though one has "128 pixels per clock" and the other has "320 pixels per clock" as an example I didn't assess the clock speeds or anything like that of the 2 cards I linked but implied the are of a similar comparable "series". You cant just go buy one parameters or another but must understand they have differences but still achieve a similar outcome. Otherwise one will get left behind and lose significant sales and market share!

    http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/132

    http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/131

    Hmmm and the particular products I linked are here:

    The Diamond Viper is the better arguably with a core clock of 725MHz and 900MHz:

    http://www.diamondmm.com/3850PE3512O.php

    http://www.xfxforce.com/web/product...ce™+8800&productConfigurationId=1961684

    But be real clear I said nothing like your implying!!!!
     
  17. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Oh now I think I see what your implying the nVidia is 256Bit whereas the card you linked is 128Bit will leave it at that, twice the memory bandwidth!!!
     
  18. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    ok i get it, with a little more research i found charts like this one http://techreport.com/r.x/radeon-hd-3800/crysis-4xaa.gif and i guess nvidia with more memory bandwidth is better than ati with more clock cycles. and btw i do plan on using my pc at a tv, with satellite hdtv going into a tv tuner card, a ps2, and a gamecube also somehow connected weather by av to ip, or by a switchbox for the tv tuner
     
  19. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

  20. Fred_G

    Fred_G Heat packin' geek

  21. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Well honestly it confuses the heck out of me cause you can get newer series cards with apparently slower Cores and memory but with a lot smaller circuitry say 65microns (65um) down to 45microns (45um) and thus have a lot more capacitors and or transistors per square inch and are therefore a lot more efficient.....as long as you did a bit more research thats what really matters. There is one card out there at the moment with 384Bit but it performs slightly worse than some of the 256Bit....it confuses me but as long as you had a greater look.
     
  22. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Okay Video Card says it is $169.99

    That PSU I have never heard of and a little research indicates it is a bit rubbishy, I use this for my baseline which leads to the following 2 links (from OCC forums dudes who love to push there systems):

    http://forums.overclockersclub.com/index.php?showtopic=63579
    leading to
    http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=108088 (it can be seen that Rosewill fall into the Tier 5 category "NOT Recommended").
    http://www.80plus.org/manu/psu/psu_join.aspx

    Some PSU's that do have a good name, same price:

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104954
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371007
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104953
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171018 (didn't check this one but these are okay!)

    Only review I have "ever" read were Crucial Ballistix got knocked over, basically they win "every review" I have ever read excepting this one!:

    http://www.madshrimps.be/?action=getarticle&number=1&artpage=1718&articID=424 (this site writes some pretty good reviews and seem unbiased).
    and some Super Talent RAM
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820609027

    Check out Super Talent reviews, I dont think they should be underestimated!

    Frankly I don't like that Motherboard but I cant give you a technical reason why yet but it just "looks" cheap and nasty. Let me do a little more research there.
     
  23. dlb

    dlb MajorGeek

    I totally agree! Yes, it's true, 'Super Talent' may be one of the worst company and product names ever, but don't hold that against 'em! I have been running Super Talent memory for years and have never had a problem. They have a lifetime warranty too, so if something does happen to go wrong, they'll replace it. Super Talent also makes all types of USB devices and have now started making power supplies. They have a 700w that I saw compared against 7 other name brand PSUs that were all 750w to 1000w, and the SuperTalent consistently scored in the top half in all the tests. I think it sells for about $100 or $125. If you're interested in the review (a total of 8 high-end PSUs were tested), here's the link http://techreport.com/articles.x/14064 The same web site has another article where they tested/reviewed 11 different PSUs in the 500-750w range. Lots of good info there too: http://techreport.com/articles.x/13271/1
     
  24. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

  25. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

  26. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

  27. ghettowhiteboy

    ghettowhiteboy Private E-2

    I like the reviews on the biostar better than those link(cons are missing cable, confusing bios, not enout input jacks etc., where those are bad bios, driver issues things like that), second I've been googling the crap outa intel vs amd, core 2 vs x2, etc. the only thing i found is a core 2 may run my games at 5-10% higher frame rate but when it comes to linux x2 will run 25-50% faster(which i do plan on setting up dual boot and vmware, both running the same copy of linux).

    also i've had a biostar tf7050-m2 before running a 4200 2gb ram, sata 250 and advd burner, wish i hadn't sold it. If I had to give a review it would get a 5 star, pros, ran very cool on air, cheap, easy to set up. cons, didn't come with the tv out bracket, but it also wasn't advertised with one. any other thoughts, keep the cd, the website containing the drivers is down 75% of the time.
     
  28. Bold Eagle

    Bold Eagle MajorGeek

    Well I dont want to start a flame war so heres a few articles, but with some googles on "AMD Phenom Quad Core Vs Intel reviews" or AMD Vs Intel Quad reviews:

    http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-phenom-x4,1935.html

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/ptech/12/21/amd.processor/index.html

    http://www.legionhardware.com/document.php?id=735&p=7

    And the articles start to appear, refine/play around with the "key words" and you start to produce more specific articles.

    As far as the motherboards go it's upto you at the end of the day. The Biostar you like has only 27 "reviews" compared to the 1517 (Asus) and 296 (MSI). So yea the Biostar has "slightly" better reviews but what if 5 employees from Biostar had written reviews? then the data would be "skewed". You are basing your decision on a small amount of reviews by potentially "non-technically" qualified people. The article I linked was heavily referenced by technical reviews sites and indicated both of those boards. It's upto you.
     

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