Cd Burner , firmware/driver installation confusion

Hi I had a really long thread trying to figure out my A-Open CD burner's driver earlier in the year. Thought i should start fresh with a condensed version of what the forum helped me through so far:

Installed the CD burner (Master on secondary IDE). It worked fine as CD-ROM but needed software to burn. Gave up on using the bundled Nero software (it caused a 'device ios error' that remained a mystery) and switched to trying "Deep Burner" or DB. No Error message with DB!! but when trying to burn a CD in the program it would say: " ASPI initalized---Looking for available drivers---No drives found." Looking at the burners properties in the device manager it indentified the burner as "device type: CD-ROM" not as a CD recorder. The drive was provided by microsoft and i guess it's not a CD-Burning driver.

So then "General Information" sent me to the A-open dowload site (link below) to get the correct driver for my burner. So it took me months to figure out exactly wich model i had....the CRW5224... so now i'm back with some confusion over what's firmware and what's the driver and if i still need to find a driver.

PROBLEM ONE:

I saw this message posted at the top of this forum:
Firmware for CD/CDRW/DVD drives:
WARNING: FIRMWARE IS THE CORE SOFTWARE COMPONENT OF HARDWARE DEVICES AND IS HELD MOST OFTEN IN A FLASHABLE RAM MODULE. IF YOU CHOOSE TO UPDATE YOUR FIRMWARE ON ANY DEVICE, YOU DO SO AT YOUR OWN RISK. A FAILED UPDATE CAN CAUSE YOUR DEVICE TO STOP WORKING COMPLETELY.

Because i downloaded the latest firmware for my model here:
http://download.aopen.com.tw:/Default.aspx?nothing=nothing&sDropDownCategory=Firmware&sDropDownModel=CRW5224&Language=English&WebSite=GL

This links to the latest "firmware" for my burner. If you go to this link and see the drop down menu that says "firmware" on it and then chose "driver" it takes you to the Driver section for my model. There's nothing there to download. Suggesting that to get a recording CD-R driver i just need to update the firmware. But according to this warning above firmware flashes the drive itself. So i might still be stuck without an actual driver that would make DeepBurner recognize my CD burner?

PROBLEM TWO:

I also allready tried using the downloaded firmware R1.08 and have run into a problem. I double click the program and first get a 'procedure window' telling me to "Target Drive to CRW5225" once i'm in setup, then i get the setup program, it's an "RFalsh" Window. At the top it says it's the : "DVD+RW, CD-R/RW Drive F/W Update Program 95/98/Me/NT4/2000/XP" My problem is that in the drop down menu to select a target drive there's nothing there. It's blank and i can't type in it and there's no browse button. It seems the flash program can't find my CD-burner. How can i solve this problem?

So if i have a cd-rom driver from microsoft loaded for my CD-burner would even trying to update the firmware be a mistake? Is there allready some sort of firmware in my burner?Sorry about the long post and all the questions but wanted to put all info in to minimize re-postings. Thank you very much for your time.

Robet707

 

Well, I would hate to tell you not to update the firmware, But I will. If you put in nero again it has the ability to see the drive and tell you what firmware it has in it now, Before you begin to even think about updating the drives firmware. If you do it with the wrong firmware OR have what you're doing now, you are born to fail with the update and have a paperweight or a doorstop. You can also check your drive by going to device managment and looking at the drive properties, but that will not tell you like nero will. You need to know, What firmware (ver) it has NOW before even attempt to update. I have no idea what operating system you're running, you never said that I could see, I never looked what drive you have I see you said its a cdrw/dvd drive but it would be faster to list what you have.
If you don't have dma enabled you will have problems and you need dma enabled on the harddrive as well, by going into device managment and firmware updating is the last option to be taking.

Another question for you, What was the problem (error) you were having with nero? If I might ask. Did you update nero? what is the (ver) you have? I guess to begin with.

 

Answering questions from below:

I can check the firmware version in the device manager and it says 1.06. But is that "A-Open" firmware inside the drive or is that microsoft firmware loaded on from my Win98SE disk? Because on the 'driver' tab it says provider: microsoft.

It's an A-Open CD-R/RW. Model number CRW5224. There's a link below in my first post.

My operating system is Win 98 SE.

I can't use Nero(OEM version) cause the Error comes during installation:

After installing NERO it asks me to reboot. During reboot i get this message:

"While initializing device IOS: Windows protection error. You
need to restart computer."

Rebooting will take me to the "start-up" menu where I can choose "Safe-mode
with command prompt only" or "Safe Mode with Network Support" or "Command
prompt Only" . Choosing anything else LOOPS me back to the error message. In
"Safe Mode with network support" i can unistall Nero to get my system back
to normal.

All of wich is why i switched to DEEP BURNER, which can't find my driver, wich is why i need to find out if updating the frimware is the only way to get the official driver in. Because this is the exact firmware for my model from the manufacterer's website. So the only reason i have to think it might cause problems is if it conflicts with whats allready there wich is the Microsoft CD-ROM driver. Would this R-Flash thing replace it or would it be a disaster?

HEY BAD_FLASH!!!
Would enabling 'DMA' on both the driver and the hard drive be something you want me try first? Would that solve my prob from "PROBLEM 2" below? (the flash program can't find my CD-burner. How can i solve this problem?)

IMPORTANT CAUTIONARY QUESTION : I'm needing to figure out how to get my burner working 'cause my hard-drive's dying, and i need to back up my files. Would enabling the DMA on my hard-drive put a strain or increase the death-speed of a slowly degrading hard-drive?

Sorry about responding late, my e-mail notification isn't working

Rob

 

Robert, you need to understand a few things so you don't chase dead ends.

All optical drives like CD burners etc don't need or use drivers in Windows.

Windows has native support for all optical devices ever since Windows 95b.

Burning software requires an ASPI layer in order to communicate with the drive, but that's it.

Firmware is a set of instructions stored on a chip in the drive.

One of the few valid reasons for flashing with new firmware is for media compatibility, but for your problems, it won't have any result. Flashing the firmware is a last resort!

What I would do is download Nero's Info Tool (Free) if you don't have it and check that your drives and ASPI are installed and working correctly.

 

Hmmm...

Thems look like drivers to me.

 

Have you tried any other programs?

Maybe Deepburner doesn't support your drive. It sounds like its an older device.


What drivers are loading with the device?

 

Looks can be deceiving. They are not drivers in the true sense of the word, they don't have any instructions or "orders" like a "regular driver".

Drivers are not required for Windows to use regular optical drives.

If you think they are drivers, tell us where we can update our drivers from and why drive manufacturers don't supply them on their site?

He already said he tried Nero.

t's an AOPEN 52x 24x 52x , they don't come very much newer than that!

 

Yeah ok.

Heh.

 

So...

What do they do then?

I'll answer that one.

cdrom.sys is for reading CDs
redbook.sys is for cd audio
imapi.sys is for the XP CD burning software, to write to CDs.

Remove one, lose features, or drive functionality altogether.

Not a driver?

Could have fooled me!

 

Is that the best you can come up with?

If they are technically drivers, where can I update mine please?

Anyway, this really is very pendantic and childish.

We both know why you are doing this, but it doesn't help the author one bit.

 

Good point, it is pointless.

I can't ague with your logic:

They aren't drivers, because they cannot be updated.

Of course, mine were updated when i installed SP2...but that doesn't count I suppose

 

Your "logic" is even better.

Supply a microsoft link, then say that you're right and the link is wrong.

As I've said, we both know why you are doing this, going through all my posts then using Google to double check everything.

I thought you were one of the more intelligent people here, but if that's what you like, I can do the same.

 

Lugztaz, I'm more than happy to debate this with you if you like.


DOS, Windows/3.1X 95a, OS2, WARP, NT, UNIX, NetWare, SCO, UNIXWare, use true drivers.

SCSI drives use true drivers, not IDE optical drives in Windows.

 

Lugztaz, you are a child.

You called me a punk, told me to go to another forum, then you were so gutless that you edited it.

I've never even spoken or heard of you?

As far as I'm aware, most forums ban people for flaming other members.

At least Adrynalyne doesn't resort to name calling.

 

Why did you edit your post?

How gutless!

 

I thought you need a learnes premit before you could drive anyway LMAO, Glenn


but since there are no drivers,,I'll take the bus hehehehehe

 

ok this thread i started has turned into some sort of virtual geek-cat fight, the bottom line is i need to clear up a problem here and endless tit-for-tating i SO weak when no one's actually ever saying anything to anyone's face.

Anyway......

I'm still very confused about one aspect wich i would like cleared up if nothing else:

Like i said in my first and second posts... under the device manager, the burner is discribed as a "DEVICE TYPE: CD-ROM" not a CD-R. Wouldn't this be because of having the wrong driver? Is there a CD-R specific driver i need? Becauese there IS a driver listed under the properties for this burner as Adrynalyne pointed out.

Also deep-burner can't find my CD-R cause it says; "ASPI initialized - Looking for available drivers- NO drives found"

So what are those drives that aren't found.?

thank you for your time.

 

Whether they are called drivers or oranges is irrelevant.

If my post confused or mislead you, accept my apology.

My main point is that Windows has native support for all optical drives ever since Windows 95b.

You don't have to worry about drivers. AT ALL.

You just install your drive with the correct Master/Slave setting, make sure it's enabled in the Bios, and that is it.

I could explain why they aren't technically drivers but that wouldn't acheive much apart from confusing you or starting another heated "debate".

Windows sees the burner as a CD Rom, that is fine and doesn't suggest a problem.

Is the burner listed correctly in My Computer?

If you can read and play CD's but not burn to them, then the culprit is probably your ASPI layer.

Burning software generally either uses it's own ASPI layer that it installs, or needs a system ASPI layer.

As I suggested before, download the free and very handy Nero Info Tool to check your set up and ASPI support.

Post back with any details from the tool and that may help.

 

In reponse to Insomniac's last post.:

Hey it is true that when i try to use Deep-Burner it says : "ASPI initialized - Looking for available drivers- NO drives found" so doesn't that message mean that the ASPI is working if it's initialized?

Well here's my Nero-info tool results, i took out the codecs,drivers and patches so it would be a bit shorter. If you need any of htat let me know.

Under ASPI it says my Nero ASPI is not installed. But if my System ASPI is working shouldn't i be able to use Deep- Burner? [[ Because as mentioned, trying to install Nero causes the "device IOS , windows prtection error", please check previous posts]]
[blue]
My Nero Info tool results:
Nero InfoTool 2.07
Interface Information
---------------------
Adapter 1
---------
Description : Primary IDE Channel
Driver
Description : ESDI_506.pdr
Company : Microsoft Corporation
Version : 4.10.2222
Description : ESDI_506 Virtual Device (Version 4.0)
Attached Devices
Description : GENERIC IDE DISK TYPE47
Type : Disk Drive
DMA : Off
Adapter 2
---------
Description : Secondary IDE Channel
Driver
Description : ESDI_506.pdr
Company : Microsoft Corporation
Version : 4.10.2222
Description : ESDI_506 Virtual Device (Version 4.0)
Attached Devices
Description : 52X24X52 CD-RW
Type : CD-Rom Drive
DMA : Off
Autorun : On
Description : ASUS CD-S500/A
Type : CD-Rom Drive
DMA : Off
Autorun : On

Software Information
--------------------
Operating System : Windows 98 SE
DirectX : DirectX 8.1

Hardware Information
--------------------
CPU : AMD Athlon Processor 800 MHz
Bus Speed : 100 MHz
Motherboard : ASUSTeK <A7V>
System : System System Name
BIOS : Award ASUS A7V ACPI BIOS Revision 1003
Memory : 128 MB
Sound : SB Live! Wave Out [A000]
Video : ASUS AGP-V7100 SDRAM v12.60
-------------

ASPI Information
----------------
System ASPI : ASPI is installed and working properly
WNASPI32.DLL : 4.60 (1021) 45056 bytes May 13, 2000
APIX.VXD : 4.60 (1021) 22603 bytes May 13, 2000
WINASPI.DLL : 4.60 (1021) 5600 bytes May 13, 2000
ASPIENUM.VXD : 4.60 (1021) 7743 bytes May 13, 2000
Nero ASPI : ASPI is not installed

[/blue]

 

Q: "doesn't that message mean that the ASPI is working if it's initialized?"

A: No, it could be initilised but still corrupt, but yours is fine though as the Info Tool reports that "ASPI is installed and working properly" ( I might add you have one of the best and most stable versions of ASPI, 4.60)


Q: "But if my System ASPI is working shouldn't I be able to use Deep- Burner?"

A: Yes, in theory as far as ASPI is concerned.

Burning programs use ASPI to communicate with the drive.

Some burning programs don't rely on System ASPI and install their own, like Nero for example. ( XP for example doesn't include ASPI )

One big glaring problem I spotted straight away is that you have DMA turned off or not available for all your channels.

I would check you have the correct, updated drivers for your motherboard controllers, and then make sure that you have DMA mode enabled and not PIO mode.

This is very important, especially with an underpowered system like yours.

 

I don't know my way around the device manager and i'm nervous about tinkering where i should'nt , exactly how may different places should i check the DMA box? Like wich things? 'cause there's a bunch of places that have that little box.

Exactly how does the Device manager describe the mother board, for me to update the driver?

will check back tommorow night, thanks for your help. I feel like i'm getting closer!!

 

Whether we are getting closer or not is another matter, but regardless, DMA is highly desirable even if it doesn't solve this particular problem.

Q: "exactly how may different places should i check the DMA box? Like which things"

A: DMA should be enabled in the Bios for each device, and again for each device at software level in Device Manager.

Basically, if you have the option to enable DMA then do so (one by one in stages to make sure your system accepts it, and so you can easily reverse it if the need arises)

This includes not only optical drives, but also hard drives.

However, if you aren't using the correct drivers, then DMA won't stay enabled or it won't work properly.

The first step is to make sure you are using the latest compatible drivers, then make sure all the appropriate settings like DMA etc are used.

Download a copy of EVEREST, which will tell you what the hardware is and usually provide links for drivers.