Why can't I delete folders?

This is becoming really annoying. My Vista installation insists that I need permission to delete the folders that are left behind when I uninstall programs and applications. I click on "Continue", and then find myself denied access and I am told to try again. I try again, and the same thing happens.

My account has administrator privileges, so I didn't exactly expect to run into this kind of problems. How do I solve them? :confused

 

You'll have to take ownership of the folder.

Check this out: http://www.mydigitallife.info/2007/...n-to-files-and-folders-context-menu-in-vista/

 

Next question: Why on earth is this TrustedInstaller thing limiting my rights to delete folders with files that not of use to the operating system? If it was a system folder I could understand but anything in Program Files? Anything in My Music? Why? What's the reasoning behind this?

To increase my frustration, after following the many many steps in how to take ownership of a folder in Vista, I still can't delete it. (I'll save my frustration and surprise over the five groups of users and the accounts that were listed, none of which I have created or where aware of. Let's just say that I am homesick for Ubuntu, where the file permissions system made sense.)

 

First of all, have you tried booting into Safe Mode as an administrator and deleting your folders? If you have and that doesn't work....

I think many Vista users think either you're logged in as admin with full root privileges or you're not, but I think it's more complicated and there are more possibilities in Vista than full admin or limited user. In particular there are in Vista, I think, some flavors of administrator with limitations, as Mimsy has experienced.

I'm not very clear on all the ins and outs myself as am still using XP on my own machines, but occasionally help my girlfriend out with her Dell Vista laptop as needed.

I'm not sure this is the best way to deal with your problem Mimsy (or if this will even solve it), but read the linked article on one way to get full Vista admin privileges. There are reader responses at the bottom of this linked page with some lively debate about this approach to Vista admin privileges also:

http://www.rlslog.net/make-yourself-a-real-administrator-in-vista/

I think Mimsy understands what this UAC stuff is about, but for those who'd like some further discussion of the subject (and of other Vista features also intended to enhance security), in addition to the first link, look here (in the 3rd paragraph -- "User Account and User Account Control"):

http://www.winsupersite.com/showcase/winvista_security.asp

As I said, I don't have a lot of experience with Vista, so I'm not pushing any agenda pro or con (though, based on my limited experience using Vista and my satisfaction with XP, I have to say I don't think Vista is worth the higher cost MS is charging -- and I think it's unfortunate that MS decided to release so many versions of it also). I do think, in theory at least, that buttoning up admin access is a good idea, but maybe wasn't implemented as well as it should have been given that so many Vista users seem to run afoul of it as Mimsy has.

Anyway Mimsy, I thought that suggested procedure at the first link above might help you to zap the folders you want to get rid of -- even if you then decide to revert back to the default Vista admin setup.

But given my own confusion about Vista admin privileges and Vista UAC issues and various permissions settings....can someone suggest a link with a really clear explanation of the various Vista admin and UAC permission settings and how they work (or don't work) together? (Or, as I don't want to hijack this thread for my own purposes, maybe send me a pm with some good links discussing and explaining clearly these Vista features. I'm not so interested in theory as actual practice and use. And I'm not particularly interested in reading someone's Vista rant, whether pro or con. The fact is many of us have to use Vista now and then and need to know how to effectively deal with these admin privilege issues.)

 

Deletion rights are limited for security purposes, Mims. I'm not sure that MS set it up in a way thats logical, but that is the reason its there. Therefore, taking ownership of a folder actually diminishes security for that folder. Of course, when ya gotta do it, you gotta do it.

 

Rather than disable UAC, its much better to use the real admin account, then disable it when you are done.

http://adrynalyne.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!AB9DE24BE9AF1B9F!206.entry

 

That won't work in Vista, where she is attempting to nuke folders.

 

Thanks for posting that link Adrynalyne. I printed your instructions out and will keep them at hand for my occasional forays into Vista territory. MS surely could have made all this easier and still as secure, I think, but maybe that would have made it more tempting to turn off or opt out. It's surely better to just turn on the full admin when you need it and then turn it off again or at least password protect that account.

Thanks again! :clap

 

Probably wouldn't have hurt for MS to follow something like sudo. Something for another discussion at any rate. There is a pdf of that procedure in the public folder on my blog, by the way

 

Right -- I should have said that. It was the pdf file that I downloaded, saved and printed out. Thanks again Adrynalyne!

Mimsy, have you looked at Adrynalyne's link/page and tried using that procedure to get full admin rights in order to zap the unwanted folders? Any luck?

 

Or maybe not a sudo security model, rather, given its popularity, a sudoku problem as the gatekeeper! "Please enter the solution for the sudoku diagram below. If your sudoku solution is correct and your user name has been entered into the list of users authorized for the operation you have initiated, you will be asked for your password. If your password is then authenticated, and this month does not have more than 4 Fridays in it (an extra measure of security) and if you can still remember what it was you wanted to do in the first place...."

But seriously....yes, a prompt for a security password, as I believe sodo uses, would have been a lot more user friendly than what MS did. Vista gives the user with a legitimate need to make system changes very little help in working through the security barriers.

Hmmmm...yes....I've got it...the ultimate security gatekeeper!!! But I think it would be more appropriate to post it in the off topic lounge! roflmao

 

The real admin account? So the one labelled "Administrator" doesn't actually have full admin rights by default? I went in there to try and delete the folder in question, and ran into the same problems. For those curious the folder I am trying to remove is the one my graphical Folding client was in. I uninstalled it, and I want to remove the folder it was installed to, so I can do a clean reinstall.

I would also like to know what the Vista equivalent of root is. Is there an easy way to enable it when I need it and disable it when I don't need it anymore? Like the sudo <password> function in Ubuntu, for example? Edit: Whops, I didn't see your more recent post on topic. There is no sudo-equivalent then?

Edit 2: It's still doing it. I followed Adryn's link, did the net user administrator /active:yes command, pressed Enter and logged out. Then I logged into Administrator and tried to delete the folder, but it still denied me access.

 

Try taking ownership from the Admin account.

 

you know, my other thought is that there is still something in use, thats in that folder.

 

I have gone into task manager several times to make sure that nothing in the folder is in use, but I haven't yet tried to take ownership of the folder from the Admin account. I assumed I wouldn't have to. I'll go try that right now... back in a few.

 

Aha! Taking ownership worked! :celebrate

I am considerably less frustrated by the file permissions in Vista now that I know that I can delete folders when I want or need to. I'll just leave the Admin account enabled, and make sure I don't lose the little sticky note where I put the password.

 

Ah, good! A happy ending at last.

So, is it correct to summarize that in order to delete your folder you had to:

1) Gain access via the "real" administrator account and...

2) Then take ownership of any folders before attempting to delete them...is that a fair summary of what you needed to do?

Final question (to Adrynalyne I guess)...what terminology or name is used in Vista or MS speak to distinguish what you're calling the "real" administrator account from the other limited rights admin accounts that most of us assume are what we need until we find they don't allow us to do the tasks we expected to be allowed to do? Or is there any specific accepted term in widespread use? If not, I think that's part of the problem with Vista UAC/admin privileges that MS should have anticipated.

Oh well, at least some of us now know what hoops to jump through to get full admin access in Vista and that even once we have full admin access we still need to take ownership of a folder first in order to delete it.

Thanks again Adrynalyne for your insight and help with Vista permissions/admin rights issues.

 

Well, the Administrator account is just that; the built in Admin account, that does not adhere to UAC. Any other account may say its an admin account, but its really not, as UAC is invoked whenever elevated rights are needed. Now if you turn off UAC, then those accounts would be true Admin accounts. But there are disadvantages to turning off UAC, which is why I dont reccomend it. There are different levels of UAC that I would reccomend using (like Quiet Mode) instead of turning it off. Mimsy's issue was somewhat unusual, it shouldn't normally have needed the true Admin account.

UAC quiet mode: http://adrynalyne.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!AB9DE24BE9AF1B9F!209.entry

 

So Administrator = Root?

 

Correct.

 

That makes a lot more sense. Can I temporarily become Administrator, or do I need to log in to that account for that?

 

Sure, by turning off UAC. Logging into the other account is easier though.

No sudo-like interface, sorry :/

Maybe check out UAC Quiet Mode on my blog.

 

So in other words, if I want to keep UAC, since I feel naked without it, then I'll just have to keep logging into Administrator whenever I want root-privileges. Okay, I can do that. Not the smoothest or most convenient way of doing things, but I can probably get used to it.

 

Yeah thats how I am doing it.