Win XP startup delay

I have a strange glitch in my rebuilt PC.

When I start the machine, Windows XP boots up, I get to the log on screen, click my username and the desktop loads, along with the few items that I have in my system tray. If I then try to run an application or game, having double clicked the icon, the mouse cursor changes to the egg timer briefly, then nothing happens for the best part of a minute, when finally, the games/apps splash or start screen loads and off we go.

If, when I start up, I wait at the log on screen for a minute or so before clicking on my user name, then once in windows, ever app / game starts as it should - i.e. straight away.

During the “mini-hang” there appears to be no HDD activity.

This glitch doesn’t happen with all apps / programs. I haven’t checked everything, but as an example I’ve found that Hidden And Dangerous 2, and 3Dark2001se hang, command prompt, Word2000, and Excel2000 don’t.



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(Having trouble editting my post, this is how it should have appeared)
I have a strange glitch in my rebuilt PC.
When I start the machine, Windows XP boots up, I get to the log on screen, click my username and the desktop loads, along with the few items that I have in my system tray. If I then try to run an application or game, having double clicked the icon, the mouse cursor changes to the egg timer briefly, then nothing happens for the best part of a minute, when finally, the games/apps splash or start screen loads and off we go.
If, when I start up, I wait at the log on screen for a minute or so before clicking on my user name, then once in windows, ever app / game starts as it should - i.e. straight away.
During the “mini-hang” there appears to be no HDD activity.
This glitch doesn’t happen with all apps / programs. I haven’t checked everything, but as an example I’ve found that Hidden And Dangerous 2, and 3Dark2001se hang, command prompt, Word2000, and Excel2000 don’t.
My system is set up as follows:
DFI Lanpart Ultra B mobo, Athlon XP 3200+, 1GB Kingston HyperX PC3500 DDRAM, 2x Striped WD 74GB SATA Raptors(using SIL 3114 RAID controller), 2x Seagate 160GB SATA Barracudas, Asus Radeon 9800XT 256MB graphics, Lite-on CD/DVD combo, Sony DVD rewriter.
I’ve disabled both onboard LAN ports and installed a D-Link Wireless network card, which I’ve had disabled whilst I look into this problem.
Before the rebuild, my setup comprised all as above, except: Asus A7N8X Delux mobo, only the two Barracudas, mirrored on the SIL 3112A RAID controller, Hercules Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB graphics, both LAN’s disabled, and the D-Link Wireless LAN installed and active.
I’ve updated the BIOS and have updated the Catalyst drivers for the graphics card, and I’ve also made sure that I‘ve got the latest RAID drivers, none of these changes had solved the problem.
Any clues anybody?

 

Just to say that there are more oppinions about Bootvis than 1. MS stopped supporting it or what was it? Never did any good to me or my startup thats for sure. It cant get any faster anyway. Benefits not big enough and you will have to know what you are doing, should work without Bootvis so may be save that one for later when there are no problems.

Event-viewer should help. If not you could have some weird mb/bios problem that only DFI ppl will know about, try find a hw-forum - best to get such details from ppl who know them.

I know from Abit NF7-S that using RAID is not allways that easy. There are good and bad combos of onboard SATA bios and drivers. Normally latest is the best but you use different controller. You need fello DFI users I think. You dont mention Nvidia 3.13 but guess no need since you know about bios, NF2 drivers, Catalyst etc. Network something or SATA something I would guess - but do check event story.

Or IDE - You could beta-test latest Nvidia IDE driver, 4.15. There are issues fixed with specific IDE devices. Ive read they shoudl release new chipset package this month so may be a late (safe) beta? Look at "Changes" http://www.nvidia.com/object/nforce_ide_4.15_win2KXP.html Lite-on? If you think ok then you go back to MS IDE driver you should again consult some hw-forum unless cause that must be done after the book or you can end up with a non-booting XP. Pull the plug from CD-drives should do for a quick-test.

http://www.nforcershq.com/forum/index.php?sid=adbef13b64d6bff639302def022f498e seems to be down now but "Drivers" forum are full of reports of old and new Nvdia drivers. See if you can find your devices in all those stories.

 

OK JSDK

Again i find you telling people to ignore advise given, in fact Bootvis is a very useful tool and if used properly can shave a fair bit of time off loading and arrange files into correct order to prevent apps hanging on start-up

That could well be caused by messed up boot order, hanging service or application or possibly a device driver at least Bootvis will attempt to put everything in order
Yes XP has removed support for this app, not because it doesn't work just that XP does this itself over a period of time, but seeing as this is a new build Bootvis could indeed help Stop believing every thing you read on the net

Now thats just insulting, theres plenty of knowledgeable people right here at Majorgeeks thank you

Good advice dude couldn't find anything on the net so guess you were stumped

Again Insulting



Anyway back to the original problem, boot into safe mode and see if that makes a difference post back with results
Also make sure you follow Robos excellent advise and visit Black Vipers site and get your running services in order

 

What on earth are you on? Im merely stating facts and findings, possible issues etc - which is not based on 1 url only of course.

Bootvis is NOT there to cure problems for crying out loud.

How is it insulting to say fiddling with Nvidia/MS IDE drivers can be highly risky? You tell me. FACTS Mr. and something he just might start to test so I thought it was worth a note.

If you knew more about bios/mb issues you would know why I suggest he find DFI forum - if nothing else helps. Sure if someone here have same hw he/she can help but mostly you find mb geeks on mb forums. Irelevant? ok...

 

Right im going to get my tea, so ill make this quick

Not the fiddling with the drivers just you saying go elsewhere for advice

Bootvis can arrange files,drivers etc into the fastest and most efficient loading order which may well resolve the issues described in the original post seeing as once he waits for everything to load he has no problems with programs hanging
Exactly why Xflat reccomended trying it in the first place, only for you to once again come along and crap on the advice posted

 

And I repeat computer should work just fine with no Bootvis... I am aware of what Bootvis do and have read 100s of userexperiences with it, an old story with XP. Im not spamming or butting in eager to disagree with anyone... He also have problems after load btw. Dont make nonsense of what I write, I said Bootvis can be questioned as a "tweak" and defintely as "fix". Not really crapping on anyone is it? I just post what I think is most helpful not what agree with this or that person.

Well so you dont really know about Nvidia IDE drivers and the mess it can create? Just noticed I, once again, didnt agree with someone. Nice and helpful, once again... It IS very risky to deal with and he SHOULD know exactly what to do. There are guides, even a website with special tools avail. Very complicated or at least it can be. Naturally Im too afraid to link to anything now. You get loads of info on all sorts of cd-devices from that forum link but my bad... May be it would be nice to get confirmation or the opposite before experimenting? I dont get your approach or behavoir at all.

 

Funny how no one ask if he have all XP updates Who knows... www.microsoft.com ooops

 

Ok thats a fair point, pity you had to be sarcastic about it

Theres no harm in linking to relevant information everybody does it, just questioned earlier if thats the sum total of your knowledge or if you actually post anything you didnt read on the net

Anyway i posted some info about tact in the other thread maybe you should think about it

And with that I'm off to watch the football, if you want to continue this further i suggest you PM me

 

Well this will sound strange but I really do try to NOT post about things I have no clue about. I have had NF2 for a long time and every day kept up with latest findings, issues etc. on may be 5-10 hw forum around the net - if you want to know. I dont feel I have to justify my posts and that certainly dont mean a damn thing - even if I could use all that info you can get in a situation where you know too much and start to question everything! Also the very experts are often guessing, there are no foolproof experts in my oppinion but you should at least have a clue. Im anti-expert really. Ok but if you say Im just quoting stuff I find here and there I start to get pissed off. To hint Im trying to piss ppl off, is it xflat this time?, is just stupid. Anyone and I do mean anyone can check out Bootvis story and relevans to this problem.

I can easily argue why I give him url to certain forum. I can find more if he likes but even if the place has its share of tossers there is also good info - and I believe also beta-testers from Nvidia. Im thinking about the scenario where he have Nvidia IDE drivers loaded but his version have issues with cd-drives OK?

Yes Bootvis result might be argued but still a useful diagnostic program, low level sorta. Just not for everyone. Bootoptimizing files/startup files - exe, dlls the lot with normal defrag will do for mankind and is way easier.

Im was sarcastic towards myself as well General - even the obvious is hidden for you when you hunt. Keep trying but it will be boring for you, I dont mind being wrong or learning something new. That is why Im here in the first place...

 

Bootvis was originally released as a troubleshooting tool, JSDK. You don't have to agree, but the fact remains.

They work fine here.

 

Well Im commenting on how they have been used by users not what MS intentions are. Also how relevant they are in troubleshooting his problem. Computer should not depend on Bootvis in any way.

Sure, Nvidia works ok here as well but if you take look at beta-notes you see specific models being mentioned. There are 1000s of combos. That is why I suggest he look up devices on that forum, possibly also a DFI forum, where they talk about Nvidia driver issues all day long. Definitely check event-viewer, could be xp problem. Just brainstorming with the IDE idea...

I went to a DFI forum, which shall remain unnamed, and found some interesting debates on that RAID controller. Hardwired problems with agp port, driver problems etc. Might be worth a look though they seem more concerned about lacking performance than actual glitches. Anyway from junior-model on Abit I know many weird things can happen when RAID is not happy. Ramtimings, psu, oc, bios-settings you name it!

Forgot to say that I know fiddling with IDE drivers can give non-booting XP from my own computer. Only after research afterwards I found I was innocent

 

Well I am still looking over this thread but I can tell you right now, IDE problems are an all the time thing, and this issue is sporadic between applications.

So no, it is not likely an IDE issue.

 

And between 3D applications too. AGP vs SATA perhaps, or just SATA. May be. Very easy to find many horror stories about that controller and also Seagate on a good DFI forum, search here first naturally. On one of those forum, which could be amdmb.com there are loads of sticky posts with all sorts of issues regarding that model. For once they seem structured, done by dfi supporter, so might be useful. Actually there more than one sticky (and very long) thread, all about troubleshooting etc. so if not XP fix needed then may be go there? For example there is a certain sata-timing setting Abit use, often cures problems on RAID setups - default of course not allways the best. DFI could have something simular, new mb = new bios = new tricks.

Those who have had problems with cd-drives often see it when ie. burning or heavy traffic. You can say that is sporadic, not like drive is unusable like running in pio mode or something. A bit like corruption on SATA controller as I understand it. Dif. apps access drives in dif ways, and Nvidia drivers move in mysterious ways but much better after 3.13 If he have one of those drives mentioned on beta-site it will not take long to confirm any improvements or if the way he see problem is typical or not.

 

Why are we assuming its a hardware problem...?


We still haven't heard back to see if Safe Mode exhibits the same problems.

 

Because it is a new build I think, new hw/bios etc. could be new drivers related to new hw... and he seems to know what he is doing - 2nd NF2 mb, probably not new to XP, aware of drivers.

Remembered this http://www.ati.com/support/infobase/4217.html fits the specs and apps in which he see problem. Data corruption in what way? Might include hanging which in 1 week time will be corruption. Omega drivers disable system btw. If used to Nvidia card then may be.

 

Well, I'm stepping out this thread, mainly because all I see is a random gathering of thoughts, and there is very little linear, logical troubleshooting. I can't even follow the thread anymore due to the jumping around.

Hope it works out, Maltese.

 

Morning everyone, I see you've all been busy whilst I've been sleeping! Thank you very much.

Didn't get much chance to put your execllent advice into practice last night when I got in. However, I did install the bootvis app - and ran into a brick wall with it. Each and every time that I attempted to reboot with Bootvis running, my boot hung, generally when the "Windows XP Pro" splash page was displayed, the progress indicator simply stopped, all disk activity ended. Had to power off to get anywhere. After powering down and rebooting, the only way of getting my o/s to load was by choosing the "Last known good...." option - even the various safe modes wouldn't load whilst Bootvis was still running.
XP is up to date from Microsoft - as of Sunday afternoon...
My plan for this evening is to check the event logs and take off the two Barracuda SATA drives as a starter for 10.
Watch this space....

 

MF, have you tried the manufacturers hard drive diagnostics to determine if there is any physical problem with the drive? Sounds like a bad HDD to me.

 

Morning all,

Got to the crux of my problem last night - checked the system event log and found that the WIA (Windows Image Acquisition) service was hanging at every boot. I disabbled it, rebooted and my problem disappeared. Luckily my scanner doesn't need this service to run.

Still cannot get the bootvis app to run (my task scheduler service is running fine), but this is less important now...

I'd still like to know why the WIA service doesn't run properly, and why Bootvis doesn't run, but for now my system seems fast and stable, so I'll worry about the other later.

Thanks for all your help.

 

Good troubleshooting, MF!

Perhaps the driver for you scanner is not quite compatible with WIA and the service is timing out when it tries to init? Just a thought. You may want to check into getting the latest driver from the manufacturer.

Some WIA driver info from MS: http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/hwdev/tech/wia/xp_wiadrvs.mspx

 

I agree with alanc, its usually an incompatible scanner or digital camera driver.