Hard Disk Drive Full But Shouldn't Be

Discussion in 'Software' started by mark59, May 16, 2012.

  1. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I do not understand this but my mother-in-law's hard drive is full. Its capacity is 31 GB. She basically has nothing much on her computer. She's got ten Word documents saved; 16 songs; and about 60 pictures. I am completely puzzled as to how a 31 GB can be full with only that amount of stuff on it. There should be loads of space left. My computer has far more stuff and is no where near as full.

    What I need help with is how can I determine if it is genuinely full or if some form of malware is trying to fool us into thinking it's full. I really am perplexed by this!

    Info if required:

    Computer - Advent DIXONSXP Notebook
    Operating system - Windows Vista Home Premium Service Pack 2
     
  2. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I like SpaceSniffer to get a quick look at the Windows partition. Big blocks are big files. Once you find where most of the space is being used we can figure out what to do from there.
     
  3. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Thank you for that. I've downloaded it to my own PC and had a quick play with it. I shall download it to the affected PC tomorrow and generate a report. I infer that I should attach that report to a post in this forum. I would need someone to look over it because I've done a report for my own PC and I do not understand all the information in it.
     
  4. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

  5. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    My own favorite disk space analyzer is JDiskReport; very clear graphical result.

    The 'J' at the beginning of the software name indicates that Java RTE must be installed on the machine where it runs.

    Below is a screenshot of my own C: drive; the whole scan took about 3 minutes. From the left pane I can then drill down to see what's taking up space in the individual folders.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Now, I am spoilt for choice. I must confess that JDiskReport looks more user-friendly to me than SpaceSniffer. I am unable to do anything though because the mother-in-law has gone incommunicado.
     
  7. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Can you please tell me how to save the image generated by JDiskReport.
     
  8. Goldenskull

    Goldenskull I can't follow the rules

    Windows Xp it self takes up 5 to 10 Gigs on the HD

    What other programs are you running on the computer
     
  9. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Nice link on the space analyzer tools, pwilliner!

    Mark, you basically want to see where your space is being used. Like Goldenskull said XP should take up about 10gb or so. 4-6gb for the WINDOWS folder and 2-6gb for Program Files folder. Maybe a couple gigs reserved for System Restore or the Recycle Bin (which you won't see using a space analyzer tool).

    So, check the size of the WINDOWS folder and Program Files folder and report those. If they are in the normal range then we can go from there. If WINDOWS is much larger than 6gb then we have to figure out why. (My estimate on 6gb is going from memory of XP, perhaps this folder can get larger over time with many updates but I seem to remember it being fairly small compared to Win7.)
     
  10. Goldenskull

    Goldenskull I can't follow the rules

    My 64bit program files say its like 23.6 or some thing but i all so got tons of stuff installed
     
  11. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Yeah, I'm going by doing a fresh install every 6mos. and having Office and Nero as my only two big programs. I'm guessing his MIL doesn't have too many programs installed.

    Just trying to figure out if it is Windows taking up the space or personal files.
     
  12. Goldenskull

    Goldenskull I can't follow the rules

    Two biggest programs i got is GTA 4 takes 14.9 and Star Trek online takes 8.0Gigs
     
  13. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I would like to report back with some useful information but it is difficult to do so. I downloaded and ran SpaceSniffer on the machine in question. It has generated a report which I've saved as a text file. The size of the file is about 380 Mb so it's far too large to attach to this message. So, I downloaded and ran JDiskReport. Unfortunately, that will only allow me to save the results in a file with the extension jdr. There is no software with which to open jdr files. The best I can do is report here the categories that the JDiskReport produced. They are given below.

    Windows 22.0 Gb
    Program Files 3.0 Gb
    Users 1.4 Gb
    Files in this directory: no size given
    Two segments in the pie chart without a label or size
    Total 28.5 Gb

    I hope this small quantity of information is a start.
     
  14. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Hi,

    I didn't realize how many files were in the Windows folder. Every program I try to get a small report ends up with it being huge.

    In Jdisk just click on the Windows folder in the pie chart. What are the sizes of the five biggest folders there? I'm looking for the five biggest folders in C:\Windows
     
  15. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    The five biggest files in Windows are:

    winsxs 12.5 Gb
    SoftwareDistribution 3.1 Gb
    system32 2.9 Gb
    Installer 1.8 Gb
    Microsoft.NET 494.4 Mb
     
  16. plodr

    plodr Major Geek Super Extraordinaire

  17. Ewen

    Ewen Corporal

    Restore points take up a considerable amount of space. How many does she have, have you considered a system cleanup, what percentage hard drive space is allocated to creating Restore points?
     
  18. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I was assuming this was XP but the winsxs folder is Vista/Win7.

    Those sizes don't look unusual at first glance. I'll take a closer look tomorrow.

    I've read to just leave Winsxs alone, but plodr's link may be necessary since I don't think it is anything mysterious eating up space but just an aging install that has accumulated various versions of different system files.

    You might want to check how much space is being used by System Restore and the Recycle Bin as Ewen has suggested. Those are the two easiest places to free up space.

    For recycle bin just right-click the icon and select Properties to see how much space is allocated.

    For System Restore go to Start and type in Create Restore then select Create a Restore Point from the search results. In the window that opens highlight the C: drive and hit the Configure button. It should tell you how much space is allocated.
     
  19. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    I just took a standard screenshot; with Windows 7 you can use the Snipping Tool.

    I believe JDiskReport itself can open these files.

    But most likely the big amount of used disk space in the Windows folder are service pack and WU uninstallers. The easiest way to clean these up is using CCleaner: Hotfix Uninstallers. (I'll have to check that on another machine that has Windows XP; it seems not to exist under Windows 7).

    Another big space waster (as already mentioned in this topic) are old System Restore Points; remove them (except the last) with the Windows Disk Cleanup Utility.
     
  20. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    I found that CCleaner option on Windows XP, but not Windows 7. It may also not exist on Vista.
     
  21. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Thank you for all the replies. It is good to know that the hard drive is actually full and it's not a malware issue. I'll have a go with the solutions provided. As I don't have a lot of time to work on them over the next few days it might be early next week before I report success or seek further assistance.
     
  22. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I've just been looking at it seems that it is safe to delete anything in c:\windows\softwaredistribution\downloads folder. So you might want to check if most of the space being used by softwaredistribution is in the downloads subfolder. If it is then that subfolder can be emptied. That might be another place to get a gigabyte or two of space without getting too involved.
     
  23. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Running the “compcln.exe” application has freed up 2.3 Gb of space. The Recycle Bin has 3265 Mb allocated to it. Should I alter this to a smaller quantity?

    I typed “Create Restore” (not the quotation marks, of course) as suggested in Search; however, it didn’t bring up any options regarding System Restore, therefore, I don’t know how much space is allocated to it.

    I cannot find Hotfix Uninstallers in CCleaner. That might be because it is not there. It might be because I’ve not looked in the correct place. It would be helpful to know where in CCleaner it is to be found.

    Eighty-nine percent of the softwaredistribution folder was allocated to the downloads sub-folder thus I’ve deleted its contents.

    The total space used in now 24.3 GB a gain of 4.2 Gb. The amount of hard drive now used by Windows is 17.4 Gb, down from 22.0 Gb. The five biggest things in Windows are:

    WinSxS 10.2 Gb
    System32 2.9 Gb
    Installer 1.8 Gb
    Assembly 618.0 Mb
    Microsoft.NET 495.7 Mb

    I don’t know if we’ve gain enough. Can any more gains be made? The hard drive is still close to being full.
     
  24. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Hi,

    I think you are about at the end of what you can do in the Windows folder. Vista like Win7 takes quite a bit of space as WinSxS grows. I think any further tweaking in that folder would be pushing your luck. From what I have seen an old Vista installation taking 30gb for "core" files is about normal. I'm guessing it is a 40gb HD with an 8gb recovery partition. So you are about at the limit for that HD. You might be able to gain a little space in Installer folder but probably not much-maybe a few hundred mb if you had some failed updates. We could look at that if you think it is worth it.

    It looks like the Recycle Bin is set at 10% of the Windows partition. That is probably very high for the type of use it gets. If she doesn't keep much in the recycle bin then you can cut that down to a more reasonable size. I always empty my bin so I keep it small. The appropriate size really depends on what type of files she deletes. If she doesn't delete any large files, such as movies, then say 500mb should be fine. Remember, she will get a warning if she tries to delete a file too big for the recycle bin so that would be a warning to maybe think twice before deleting if she wasn't sure.

    You should be able to get the size of System Restore. Try going to Start and right-clicking Computer on the right hand side and select Properties. You should see System Protection on the left hand side of the window that opens. Click that and then highlight your C: drive and hit the Configure button. There it should show how much space is allocated for system restore.
     
  25. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    Regarding CCleaner, it appears as if it does not present Hotfix Uninstallers on Windows 7 and Vista (because Windows Update is clearly different from earlier Windows versions).

    You may want to check for any installed unnecessary programs or Windows components.

    Also check if Indexing is turned on.
     
  26. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I'm not sure how this machine is set up. My laptop has a C drive which is the hard drive. It also has a D drive which I assume is for recovery. However, the laptop in question only has a C drive. According to My Computer its capacity is 31.8 Gb; it says there's 5.40 Gb free.

    I don't want to push my luck and do anything that could have a deleterious affect on her computer. I'm not too knowledgeable about space requirements. Now we have gained some space I can only see the hard drive space being used up again as WinSxS grows. Her use is to browse internet shopping sites and to talk with friends on social networks. Consequently, she doesn't really download anything. That was why I was surprised that her hard drive had filled up. I never knew that Windows grows over time. My PCs have much larger hard drives so it's never been an issue for me.

    I have reduced Recycle Bin to 500 Mb. I suspect that she never deletes anything that large anyway.

    I would like to check that I am properly attempting to set the amount of space used by System Restore. I will describe the exact steps taken. I left clicked on Start. Then I right clicked on Computer and left clicked on the option of Properties. This caused a window to open called "System". I left clicked on System protection in the left-hand menu. A User Account Control box opened and I left clicked on Continue. This opened a dialogue box (I believe that's the correct term) called System Properties. At the top there are five tabs: Computer Name, Hardware, Advanced, System Protection, and Remote. It was already on the System Protection tab. I right clicked on the C drive. However, nothing happened. So I tried left clicking it and then double left clicking it. Again nothing happened. I tried the other four tabs and none of them gave me a C drive to click on. I hope I've done it right. At the moment I haven't been able to discover how much space is allocated to System Restore. If there any other way to do this?

    Thank you very much for the help you've given to this problem.
     
  27. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I have had a look in Program Files to see if there was any applications that shouldn't be ther but I didn't discover any. I installed Revo Uninstaller on her laptop some time ago. I opened that to see if it listed any software I thought shouldn't be there. There was nothing that I could find.

    I am not sure which Windows components are optional and which we could get rid of. I've never had space issues on my own machines therefore I've never had to look into this before.

    Can you please tell me how I do that. Would it save space?

    Thanks for all your help.
     
  28. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Sounds like you are almost there on System Restore. When you left click on the C: drive in the System Properties dialogue box you should be highlighting the drive and then hitting the Configure button to bring up a new dialogue box where you can see the space allotted.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2012
  29. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I can see now where the problem is with System Restore. There is no Configure button (please see attachment). I'm still wondering if something strange is going on with this computer. The amount of used space on the hard drive has increased again. It's now saying it's only got 2.79 Gb of space left. All I have done is checked that all software is up to date. I have even uninstalled an application, namely Smart Defrag. I was going to install a more up to date version of it. I don't know whether to install now the space has decreased again.
     

    Attached Files:

  30. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I think the computer is going to die. It just keeps freezing and doing nothing. A dialogue box opens with the title "Microsoft Windows". It says: "The application is not responding. The program may respond again if you wait, Do you want to end this process?" It then gives two buttons to choose from: End Process or Cancel. I don't know what I can do for this computer now.
     
  31. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    On the system restore, I'll have to look at how Vista is set up to show how much space is used.

    On the freezing go ahead and run a chkdsk just to make sure it isn't a filesystem problem. Computer>rightclick C: and select Properties. Then Tools tab and select Error Checking. Tick both boxes and hit Check Now button. It will schedule for next reboot. Reboot and let it run. When it gets back into Vista see if it made any difference.

    Also type Disk Management into the Start box and hit enter. In the disk management window see what partitions are shown. How big is the D: partition and how much space is used on it? I'm trying to figure out if a Factory reset is an option.
     
  32. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I've spent a lot of hours on this computer today. So, as it's 12.30 a.m. I'm giving it a break. I will try your latest advice tomorrow, or rather later today. I did go into Safe Mode. I cleaned the temp and prefetch files and used Advanced SystemCare and CCleaner. I've restarted the machine back in normal mode and it seems stable now. I will however run the chkdsk later today after some sleep.

    Thanks for the advice and help
     
  33. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Get some rest. :)

    Hopefully, the freezing was an anomaly. A chkdsk can't hurt since you moved some files around. The biggest danger was working in winsxs folder. I've never done that, but you seem to have been ok afterwards.
     
  34. mjnc

    mjnc MajorGeek

  35. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    Regarding Indexing: using Windows Explorer, right-click on the C: drive and select Properties. On the General tab you will see a checkbox "Allow files on this drive to have contents indexed"; uncheck it if it is checked. Clicking the Apply button will remove all the index files from the drive. This will certainly free up a few MB.

    On the same panel you will also see a 'Disk Cleanup' button; click it. It will run for a while to see what can be cleaned up. Check everything that you think appropriate.

    Go also to the More Options tab; in the System Restore section you can remove all but the latest System Restore points.
     
  36. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I ran chkdsk. As far as I'm aware it didn't find any problems. Unfortunately, the system is still in serious trouble. When I switch it on it starts going through its processes until the log in screen appears. I login and it takes a very long time before the desktop comes up. The desk top has come up but all the usual quick launch icons still have not appeared after half an hour. I can't get it to do anything. If I try to do anything I just get the dialogue box called "Microsoft Windows" which contains the message "The application is not responding. The program may respond again if you wait. Do you want to end this process?" Then there are two buttons "End Process" and "Cancel".
     
  37. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    I have done a System Restore. It now seems to be stable. In order to get it sorted I decided to remove as much software as possible. I have left the following on, can you recommend whether it should be uninstalled: Microsoft Silverlight?

    Despite removing a considerable amount of software there is still only 6.18 Gb of space left.

    I now want to put some of the software back. Obviously, I will put an anti-virus programme back on as well as a firewall. Which of the following would you recommend that does not go back on:

    • Belarc Advisor
    • CCleaner
    • FileHippo Update Checker
    • Iobit Advanced SystemCare
    • Iobit Smart Defrag
    • Malwarebytes Anti-Malware
    • Revo Uninstaller
    • Spyware Blaster
    • SUPERAntispyware
    Thanks for the continuing help
     
  38. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I'd give it another day and see if it remains stable before doing too much. Restart it a couple times to be sure it is running relatively smoothly before adding anything new.

    Belearc, CCleaner, Revo and IObit Defrag are all relatively small programs. I don't have much knowledge of the other ones.

    I think you are always going to be running up against a wall in terms of space on a Vista partition that small. That was one of the complaints about Vista, that it grew too large too fast. Win7 isn't much better as it also grows but not quite as quickly. If she only uses it for the internet then 6gb may take her a while to fill up.
     
  39. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    Maybe you should think of upgrading the HD to something larger sometime in the future. Otherwise you will keep going back again and again to fight the current limitation.
     
  40. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Space is currently my biggest concern regarding this computer. However, I also want to ensure that it is adequately protected. This leaves me wondering which software I should put back on it to provide an appropriate level of security whilst not taking up the little space left on the hard drive.
     
  41. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    The computer seemed to be stable since I did the system restore. Yesterday evening I put an anti-virus back on it, namely avast! I then updated avast! Then, I did a full scan of the computer with avast! and it was found to be free from malware. The computer restarted fine on each occasion I tried. Then later last night I reinstalled the firewall, namely Outpost. It was also working fine after that. This afternoon I have installed CCleaner. After I had installed it I restarted the computer. Since then all it does is keep freezing. It seems that there is still some problem with it. I am stuck now with where to go with this or what to do. Help and suggestions will be gratefully received.
     
  42. pwillener

    pwillener MajorGeek

    I would suggest to make sure Windows Firewall is active, and install Microsoft Security Essentials (if not already installed).
     
  43. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    There is a firewall installed on the computer, it is up-to-date, and is active. Microsoft Security Essentials is on the computer. Can you please tell me how these will stop it from freezing and crashing. Because it is still freezing and crashing despite these applications being installed and active.
     
  44. plodr

    plodr Major Geek Super Extraordinaire

    When the free space on a hard drive drops below 20% it will start to act weird. I think that's why you are exeriencing the freezeups. Her computer requires less than 25GB used.

    The computer only has a 31GB hd which is too small for a modern version of Windows, a firewall and an antivirus program (about 72MB before updates) that gets lots of updates. The security updates and patches to Windows once or twice a month will eat up the small amount of space remaining.
     
  45. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    It looks like the best solution is going to be a new hard drive. I also think that while that is being done it would be worth getting Windows 7 installed. It runs on Windows Vista and I don't think that was the best version of Windows to say the least.
     
  46. mjnc

    mjnc MajorGeek

  47. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Those, of course, state the minimum space required on the hard drive for Windows itself. What sort of size hard drive would be needed for a PC to be able to have Windows 7 installed and allow for its growth. We also need to keep in mind that the full choice won't be possible due to economic reasons.
     
  48. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Is Microsoft Security Essentials necessary? There is a firewall and anti-virus programme on the computer (let's forget for now, it's playing up). Is Microsoft Security Essentials required if such applications are installed? Is it necessary? Is it overkill? Would they conflict?
     
  49. LancashireLass

    LancashireLass Private E-2

    You don't say which anti virus program you are using.
    Some of these create huge log files.
    I recently upgraded Kaspersky Pure to Kaspersky Pure2 and did not realise Pure2 was set to create all log files by default, within days it had used up over a hundred gig of C: drive.
    If the problem PC also uses Pure2 then you need to make sure it is not set to log none critical reports.
    Also check that the support log files are not being created and the solution to that is here:
    http://forum.kaspersky.com/index.php?showtopic=233578
     
  50. mark59

    mark59 MajorGeek

    Thank you for your suggestion. It isn't Kaspersky. I don't think anything that you suggest is going to help. Gaining a little bit of space here or there is too little. It needs significant more space than can be gained in this way. I think it's going to take a new hard drive to fix it.
     

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