Another Reason to Ditch XP

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Adrynalyne, Nov 12, 2014.

  1. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

  2. hitest

    hitest Staff Sergeant

  3. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest


    No problem. This is as big as heartbleed.
     
  4. joffa

    joffa Major Geek's Official Birthday Announcer

    Thanks for the tip off Adry :-D
    I completely missed this article and I am usually quite proactive on this sort of stuff so good one mate :cool
     
  5. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Thanks Adry, we knew this would happen eventually.
    Hopefully the all the functionality in XP will return in a later OS.
     
  6. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest


    I see what you did there. There is no functionality lost from Windows XP in future OSes, LOL. You simply do not like the later UIs.
     
  7. TimW

    TimW MajorGeeks Administrator - Jedi Malware Expert Staff Member

  8. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Adry, please stop. There are features in XP that OS since then lack. Such is the price of progress.
    I have posted these before and see no reason to deny they existed.
    One feature that is haunting me right now as I try to update our users XP is the virtual desktop size. In XP you could create a desktop larger than your screen and as you hit the side it just moved. If you use a large screen at the office and do occasional work at home this allowed you to have the same desktop with no changes, only the minor annoyance of not being able to see the whole screen at once.
    Win 7 lacks this feature and so far third party help has not been accepted well.
    http://www.planningcommunications.com/virtual_desktop.htm

    But as OP said, there is now a much larger push to change to 7 and deal with the problems.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2014
  9. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    That isn't a limitation of Windows. That is a driver level feature. Blame the manufacturers.

    I believe a Quadro card can do it.
     
  10. mjnc

    mjnc MajorGeek

  11. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Please correct me if I am wrong.
    WDDM disables this capability. However, WDDM is only the default system for graphics in Windows 7 and VISTA. The old Windows XP Display Driver Model (XPDM) is still present in Windows VISTA and and early Windows 7. The key is that you must "force install' the Windows XP display driver for your ATI card. The Windows XP display driver uses the XPDM graphics system that's still within Windows 7 and VISTA. You must install only the display driver. Install nothing else.

    This approach works if your monitor is connected via VGA or DVI.
    And it causes other issues. But as I understand it the graphics card drivers can no longer "lie" about the monitor size. No doubt this improves some things or prevents errors somewhere but it does seem to come from Windows and limit an ability.
     
  12. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    The point is, the ability to do it in XP was from the video card manufacturer. In that it was removed has more to do with lack of demand more than anything else. In that you get it working with an old driver model gives a hint: Its old. Which means it is back from when they included it.

    If WDDM didn't allow it, Nvidia Quadro cards would not have the ability to do it.
     
  13. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Adry, agreed on all counts.
    Windows changed the driver requirements and the GPU manufacturers stopped supporting pan and scan desktop with the new drivers. You blame the GPU manufacturers for not doing the extra development, I blame Windows for not being backwards compatible.
    Informative discussion and I thank you.
     
  14. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    I know, it is terrible that MS stopped supporting 13 year old drivers. What were they thinking?
     
  15. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Hehe, what they always think.
    If the product does not sell, force adoption.
    That way you can make money simply by changing with no benefit.
     
  16. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

  17. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Which leads us to
    http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2355703,00.asp
    Mostly Win 7 is a trade off speed wise. If you do all the right things XP is much faster. If you do the other things Win7 is much faster. The performance of WDDM is a trade off, no faster or slower overall. WDDM does seem more stable because when the video driver crashes the OS does not. Whether you consider this a patch to hide bad coding or an improvement is up to you.
     
  18. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    Yes it is, for GPU accelerated applications. Microsoft understands that an OS should not get in the way of applications. A worse performing driver model would hurt application performance. Nobody wins in those cases.
     
  19. DavidGP

    DavidGP MajorGeeks Forum Administrator - Grand Pooh-Bah Staff Member

    Quadro cards defiantly do this as I use them in work for viewing high res medical images, and we spec'd a few Xeon based Intel desktops to handle dual Quadro's, I do think in some respects that the hardware is a huge part of an OS working good to superb, and top spec HW used Win 7 and 8 far beats XP with same HW, due to drivers in the main., but the fact that latter Windows supports modern hardware more, SSDs and support are a huge step forward.

    XP Brilliant OS and one of the better ones, but for mission critical systems or stability and security, is old in the hat now, while many do not like change and don't like GUI changes the core of Win 7 or 8.1 is rock solid.

    We have XP and Win 7 Enterprise based OS in work and the Win 7 and Win 8.1 PCs far out perform the Win XP ones now on a Gov secure network, the performance is slow on XP, compared to Win 7, I have a business plan in now to change the HDDs to SSDs as that will add more security in data and performance as well as cost savings in the long term in power as TCO of using SSDs is now viable.
     
  20. DavidGP

    DavidGP MajorGeeks Forum Administrator - Grand Pooh-Bah Staff Member

    Quadro cards defiantly do this as I use them in work for viewing high res medical images, and we spec'd a few Xeon based Intel desktops to handle dual Quadro's, I do think in some respects that the hardware is a huge part of an OS working good to superb, and top spec HW used Win 7 and 8 far beats XP with same HW, due to drivers in the main., but the fact that latter Windows supports modern hardware more, SSDs and support are a huge step forward.

    XP Brilliant OS and one of the better ones, but for mission critical systems or stability and security, is old in the hat now, while many do not like change and don't like GUI changes the core of Win 7 or 8.1 is rock solid.

    We have XP and Win 7 Enterprise based OS in work and the Win 7 and Win 8.1 PCs far out perform the Win XP ones now on a Gov secure network, the performance is slow on XP, compared to Win 7, I have a business plan in now to change the HDDs to SSDs as that will add more security in data and performance as well as cost savings in the long term in power as TCO of using SSDs is now viable.
     
  21. DOA

    DOA MG's Loki

    Thanks for the comments, now I have to sell management on a few new laptops with Quadro GPU's.
     
  22. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    Lenovo likes to use Quadros.
     

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