XP boot issues - MBR issues - Long History

Discussion in 'Software' started by okn0tok, Aug 25, 2008.

  1. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    I installed Ubuntu on my Toshiba R15 Tablet, decided I wanted my HD space back. Deleted the Ubuntu partition. On restart I got the infamous GRUB LOADER 1.7 error.
    I then used kill disk to zero out the HD. Upon start up with no OS I just got one word: GRUB. (my favorite word now)

    I couldn't boot into the Bios because it loaded the error before I could do anything then if I did manage to get F2 hit it would just hang.

    I took apart the laptop unplugged my CMOS and restarted (knowing it would boot right to Bios to have time set) Fixed it to look for my CD/DVD drive if it didn't find the OS.

    It finally let me boot to a disk.
    I put in my XP sp3 disk.... installed windows and got:
    INTEL BOOT Agent v 4.1.16 blah blah copyright yada yada

    PXE-E61: Media Test failure, check cable
    PXE-M0F: Exiting Intel Boot Agent
    Insert system disk in drive.
    Press any key when ready.

    Again I can't get into the BIOS.
    If I boot from my XP disk or Ultimate Boot CD [UBCD] I can boot out into XP fine but on restart I get the same error.
    If I try to re-install windows it wants floppies for recovery console and gives me no option to repair the existing XP install only to format and reinstall.
    Taking me in circles.
    I was originally trying to perform either FDISK/MBR or FIXMBR but I can't get into a place to do this.

    I ran Gujin boot tool from off the UBCD and it gave me this info:

    It says it finds 4 disks
    0: ide master size 75GB partition 1
    1: atapi master 115mb partition 1 (I dont know what that is)
    2: ebios size 74GB partition 1
    3: bios size 1440kb partition 0

    Boot analysis: found 3 ways to boot 0 initial ram disks

    I know this I have one HD, I put it in there lol. I do not know how to us the UBCD cd, as in I have no clue what to run to fix the issue its a bit overwhelming.

    My question is:
    Using UBCD how can I do this? Or if you know another way, how can I fix my loading problem?

    I am sure I'm missing something here but my brain is fried at this point?

    Oh and to make it even more interesting I have to take the Ubuntu loader off my new desktop running Vista so if anyone knows how i can avoid this whole mess before hand I'd appreciate it.

    --Amy--
     
  2. chaimjm

    chaimjm Staff Sergeant

    Did you try this
    1. Restart your computer with the Windows XP Setup disk in the CDROM drive.
    2. Press the R key to start the Recovery Console.
    3. Enter "1" which should be your Windows XP installation
    4. If you set an Administrator password you will be asked for it now.
    5. At the Recovery Console command prompt, type fixmbr and then verify that you want to proceed.
    6.If your system still doesn't boot properly, repeat the steps above, but issue the fixboot command instead.
     
  3. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Yes I cannot use any key commands on start up same reason I can't access the BIOS either it locks up.
    The only choice that I have is to boot onto CD or into XP, BUT it will only boot into XP if the cd is in the computer and I don't hit "any" key to boot into it.
    If I push R it does nothing, if I push F12 which is supposed to take me into the recovery console it freezes.
    There seems to be absolutely NO way to get into the recovery console. Is there any other way I can run the command? Perhaps from a program on the UBCD?
    Im going nuts over here!
    Shalom,
    Amy
     
  4. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Try installing recovery console. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/307654

    You would boot into XP and then using the Installation Cd follow the install instructions on the link. [The very act of putting recovery console on the HD may fix the boot loader problem].
     
  5. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Other thoughts:

    How did your xp fresh install go? When you installed XP what did the installation list as available partitions? Or since you used kill disk did the XP installation just list a lot of unallocated space and you created a new partition?

    Since you basically have an empty HD, I would suggest the easiest thing to do may be find the brand of HD Seagate/Maxtor or Western Digital and download their HD utility. There will be an option to "Prepare drive for an OS install". This will fix the MBR. Then reinstall Windows. That would eliminate all the strange partition information on the disk.
     
  6. chaimjm

    chaimjm Staff Sergeant

    Have you tried to reset the Bios
     
  7. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    I finally got recovery console installed (even though microsofts instructions were wrong) big shocker there. I ran fixboot and fixmbr and it did nothing.

    I downloaded the flash bios for my laptop from toshiba... but because Im not installing the version of XP that came with it (the disk is bad) and installing a newer XP disk, it says it cant find Toshibas common modules.

    So...haha. I am going to try to find these mystical common modules and install them... if I do grand and I will try to get the bios reset, if I do not.... is there some other way to fix this?

    Also on a weird note if I use UBCD and go into Bios Tools and use the first program in there and select boot to Bios it kicks me out to a blank screen. Figures since I cant boot into the BIOS either right.
     
  8. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Yes it listed it as a lot of unallocated space, into which I installed XP. Since I have ran fixmbr I assume that info is fixed I will run Gujin again and see what it lists for drives. If its still whacky Ill see if tere is a HD util for Toshiba hd's.
     
  9. chaimjm

    chaimjm Staff Sergeant

    I don't think Toshiba has one I use Seagates Seatools from allmost all the HD I set up
     
  10. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Your HD is probably a Seagate/Maxtor or Western Digital. In My Computer right-click a drive letter C: and on the Hardware Tab it will give a Brandname for the HD. Get those tools. They may be on UBCD.

    Bios is stored on a separate chip on your motherboard. It has nothing to do with your Operating System. Since your computer starts (with a CD in the drive) your Bios is installed and working. Are you sure you are using the correct command when trying to access the Bios? For now, if you get in, I would just set to defaults and make sure that your boot order is CD first. Or just leave it alone.

    ******
    It may be as simple as a poor install of Windows, reloading--taking care to delete all existing partitions before creating a new one for the install--may be enough to set things right. Your Bios is stored separately from your HD so deleting partitions won't harm your Bios.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  11. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    OKay Update.

    I am now able to get into the BIOS, turns out I had to press escape then F1.
    So I think I have an idea of whats going on now.

    My boot order is: HDD>CDROM>LAN>FDD
    HDD boot is:
    HDD>Secondary HDD (Does it always list this option cause I only have one?)
    Then its using PXE for preboot execution environment....
    HENCE the PXE errors... I am not on a network booting onto a diskless pc so no cable to find.

    So I disabled built in LAN in BIOS and now on restart I get a simple message:

    Insert system, disk in drive
    Press any key when ready....

    My HDD is not being booted into period. This is the same with another internal laptop HD (also Toshiba brand) that I have tried.

    Toshiba DOES NOT make a HD utility.

    I will try a few other brands HD utilities to see if they will work on my HD will try to prepare for an OS install.

    I can use seagates disk manager but it only gives me an option to prepare for 95/98/nt or me install. so ill try to find another unlss selecting this option willwork for XP.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  12. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I would check to see if your boot.ini file is pointing to the correct partition. Right-click My Computer>Properties>Advanced>Startup and Recovery (Settings)>Edit

    It should look something like this:

    [boot loader]
    timeout=30
    default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
    [operating systems]
    multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect

    What number do you have for partition(#)
     
  13. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    NT is good for XP. You might be able to fix things without the reinstall if it a boot.ini problem. The no disk message is usually a matter of pointing the comp to the correct partition to boot from.

    If you go into Control Panel>Administrative Tools>Computer Management>In the left pane click Disk Management: How many partitions show up for Disk 0?
     
  14. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    OK Ive been through this easy stuff several times but I will check it again because there is no way for you know this. I appreciate any help.

    Partition is 1 the boot.ini is perfect.
    It only shows one partition.

    A little refresher on how the issue has progressed. (Backwards) LOL!

    6: I disabled PXE in BIOS so I got rid of PXE boot errors.
    5: I have done FIXMBD and FIXBOOT in the recovery console.
    4: I reset my BIOS.
    3: I have re installed XP 3 times.
    2: I have used kill disk to zero out the drive because I couldn't get rid of GRUB errors.
    1: I had grub errors from deleting Ubuntu partition of the pc. Even with a new drive that never had Ubuntu on it the pc still gave me a GRUB 1.7 error.

    THe drive works fine on another computer and this is repeatable with a different drive.

    I dont know if my BIOS is the culprit here or not. I reset it by pulling the CMOS battery last week when I couldn't even get the damn thing to boot onto a CD. Now it wont boot to the HD without a bootable CD though.

    I tried to flash the BIOS but its at its newest version and it wont let me.

    OH and my Toshiba SX2806GAX has its lastest driver (HD). There is no Utility for preparing it to install an OS.

    Heres my question can I use a utility on the UBCD to verify my boot sector is ok on my HD? Or should I perhaps FDISK the MBR?
     
  15. thesmokingun

    thesmokingun MajorGeek

    like the response above, i believe the maxtor/seagate tool is on the ubcd and you can access it to fix your mbr.....you say you tried fixmd , i hope you meant fixmbr

    you should probably change your boot order to 1 -cdrom 2-HDD 3- (whatever you want)
    however, i have had the same problem, and, while in the recovery console, i typed fixboot first (make sure you are pointing to the correct partition that your installation is on) and then fixmbr second without a restart inbetween
     
  16. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I'm not familiar with the UBCD or the available utilities. FDISK the MBR won't hurt.

    Did you change jumpers on the HD at any point. I'm trying to figure out the reference to secondary drive.

    You said you set the BIOS to defaults. I would do that again if you have that option in the BIOS screen itself. Then disable PXE if you have to later.
     
  17. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Yes I typed fixmbr.
    No the jumpers are not changed.... I dont even remember seeing a jumper on this laptop battery at all.
    I did set the bios back to defaults from inside the bios and it changed nothing whatsoever.

    Something interesting: my install of XP on my drive was not recognized by my XP cd as an windows install or NTFS system.

    Weird!

    So I deleted the partition, formatted the RAW disk NTFS and am waiting for it to reinstall.... before it boots I will change the boot order in BIOS and see what we get.
    (Oh and if it still pulls the boot error on me I will try to Fdisk the Mbr.)
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  18. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

  19. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    I did not change the jumper, I didnt remember seeing one anyway.
    I even tried setting Bios to boot from a secondary drive and it still gave the same behavior.
    I have reinstalled windows. Rand Fixboot. Same issue.
    Its still asking for system disk.

    Someone suggesting changing the boot order but to put CD first would have it looking for Lan next and give me the PXE errors again. (It sort of auto prioritizes only gives me a few choices for boot order that are preset)
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  20. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Try from the UBCD the Cute Partition Manager program. See how many partitions it lists for Hard Drive 0. And check to see if the partition whose size corresponds to your OS partition is marked bootable.

    http://www.cutepm.com/screens.htm
     
  21. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Ok,

    here is what is syays:

    Hdd 1 | Boot Filesys|-----BEGIN----|-------End-------| Start | Total |
    ________________|Hd | Cyl | Sec| Hd | Cyl | Sec| Sector | Size |
    Pri1 | Yes --|NTFS|--- 1 |--0--| 1 |254|1023|--63-|-------63------|74.52 GB
    (empty)|No |Empty|---0|1023| 1 | 15 |1023|--63--|156280320| 10.34 MB



    So what is this (empty) for HD 0? I saw unallocated space when I did the windows install but I couldnt delete or format it.
    Is the MBR looking at this?
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2008
  22. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I'm not really sure what is going on here. But BIOS is probably set okay. There is only one partition so boot.ini is set correctly. I'm thinking killdisk messed up the boot sector.

    On the CutePM results I think the HD stands for Head not Harddrive.
    What I see is that you have 254 and 15 in the same column. All examples I can find of disk analysis list the same number in this column. Like the CutePM screenshot. I would try testdisk also on UBCD looking at this example as a guide after first choosing Analyse and seeing if the quick test shows an error.

    Run the testdisk /debug /log and see it shows a discrepancy like above heads/cylinder 255 (FAT) != 240 (HD)
     
  23. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    I got the error you thought I would get!
    went into geometry and changed the number of heads to 255. Reran the analyze and did not get anymore errors.
    But I still can't boot from it... do I need to do fix boot again or something? :cry
     
  24. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I'm crying too. :lol

    What is bothering me is that the OS loads with the disc in the tray. So the HD has data on it and it the partition can eventually be found. Essentially all you did initially was wipe the HD. So the problem should be there. A re-install of XP would have written the MBR anew. So something is not right with the boot sector is my guess. I think testdisk has a function for rewriting the boot sector but I've never used it and don't want to mess you up.

    I'm going to read the whole Wiki page on testdisk and think about it. Also I'll look at SeaTools and see if something there might work. I believe their tools work on any brand disk.
     
  25. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    New development...
    Now when I go into disk management in XP it shows 9 MB of unallocated space that was NOT showing before.
    Since I have gained this back.... I dont know. See if I can make it all one partition? Is there a way to find out if this missing space was the boot sector originally? Or this impossible?
     
  26. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    You could try this and see what it says before actually writing any changes.

    http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/Advanced_NTFS_Boot_and_MFT_Repair

    But the more I read it sounds like the boot sector is created for each partition when it is created. So the boot sector for the XP partition should be fine since it was just created recently.

    The MBR command is described here: http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/Menu_MBRCode
     
  27. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Last edited: Aug 27, 2008
  28. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Ok I went into TestDisk and into boot, it tells me the same error

    boot sector
    Warning: Incorrect number of heads/cylinder 255 (NTFS) != 16 (HD)
    Status: OK

    Backup Boot Sector
    Warning: Incorrect number of heads/cylinder 255 (NTFS) != 16 (HD)
    Status: OK

    Sectors are identical
    A valid NTFS Boot sector must be present in order to access any data; even if the partition is not bootable.

    Im selecting Rebuild BS.

    It brings to another screen which says Extrpolated boot sector and current boot sector are different.

    After this it takes me into a screen where I can move files... I noticed that the files are not all on the same partition... it is really weird. I dont really understand what to do with this data.

    I select the rebuild mft and it restarted.... and booted right into ubcd.

    Also on reboot it is now saying ISOLINUX 3.35 not Intel anymore....

    This did this earlier today it seems to go back and forth. Not sure why.
     
  29. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Ok I went into TestDisk and into boot, it tells me the same error

    boot sector
    Warning: Incorrect number of heads/cylinder 255 (NTFS) != 16 (HD)
    Status: OK

    Backup Boot Sector
    Warning: Incorrect number of heads/cylinder 255 (NTFS) != 16 (HD)
    Status: OK

    Sectors are identical
    A valid NTFS Boot sector must be present in order to access any data; even if the partition is not bootable.

    Im selecting Rebuild BS.

    It brings to another screen which says Extrpolated boot sector and current boot sector are different.

    After this it takes me into a screen where I can move files... I noticed that the files are not all on the same partition... it is really weird. I dont really understand what to do with this data.

    I select the rebuild mft and it restarted.... and booted right into ubcd.

    Also on reboot it is now saying ISOLINUX 3.35 not Intel anymore....

    This did this earlier today it seems to go back and forth. Not sure why.

    So ofcourse rebuild MFT did not work nor did rewriting the MBT.

    So. Could the bios be looking to the wrong place? Or could these files be in the wrong place...
     
  30. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    ISO Linux is just a boot utility for the UBCD. If you remove the CD it would show Intel.

    I'll sleep on it. BIOS being set to defaults should be ok but maybe I'm missing something obvious.

    Oh, did you ever run FDISK /MBR? Not so much to fix the MBR but I'm wondering if in FDISK the one partition is set as active.
     
  31. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Going back to post one: I wonder if this SuperGrubDisk on UBCD would work by reinstalling GRUB :p and pointing to the first partition. http://www.supergrubdisk.org/wiki/UninstallGRUB using the WIN => MBR & !WIN! ((((((((((((((((( option.
     
  32. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Im on it! Already downloaded and installed it to a bootable disk a few hours before. Figured I should try it!

    I did it and it got ride of both the alternating loading messages (Intel and Linux) now it just goes straight to asking me for a system disk!
    lol.... darn!
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2008
  33. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    And furthermore.....
    So I decided to play around withthe disk and when going in to Boot & Tools menu and selecting Boot Master Boot Record it shows two entries:
    Natural | Linux-IDE | Linux-SCSI| GRUB| HURD | SIZE
    1------|---hda----|----sda----|(hd0)|--hd0--| 74 GB
    3------|---hdc----|----sdc----|(hd2)|--hd2--| 0 kb

    I dont know that the second line means anything.

    I also went into boot partition and got the same msg.

    When I selected the top one it shows it as windows.

    and when telling it to load the mbr it gives error 6 adhoc error.

    Mismatched or corrupt version of stage 1/stage 2.


    As a test I went into the advanced windows options and chose the option that would boot the partion if it found a boot sector and mbr and it booted the laptop into windows... so I am confused. If its there and it can be read and it can be loaded...why isnt it?

    Even overwriting the Grub so it points to windows xp did not work, although it said it was successful, on reboot I still received the system disk error.
     
  34. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Well I dont think so because I think the error said 16. I must have made a typo somewhere... I can set them to 16.

    The drive is supposed to be 80 GB,... this I am sure is due to that unallocated space size changing and it does change... this never happened until I deleted that Ubuntu partition.

    I couldnt get fdisk /mbr to run in recovery console.

    Also on another note: My desktop (which I am on) is running Vista and I used recovery console to type fixmbr and supergrub both options to try to fix it and ubuntu loader is still showing in my dual boot... I cannot get it off here. Im totally irritated.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2008
  35. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    I don't know if this is worth a try to get GRUB working. It is about a quirk in the Toshiba Bios. I'm grasping at straws here. http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-405515.html

    *******
    On the 15 hd bit, I had seen that Toshiba HDs have 16 logical heads in documentation but the way the error displayed for you in testdisk it seems the correction should be to 255 as you made it.
     
  36. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Is there anything in Bios that would let you change this to Primary?
     
  37. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Ok I get into the BIOS and there is no such option on either page of the BIOS for diagnostics.
    ----
    It is set to primary, although in mine its set to: Built-In HDD>>Secondary HDD
     
  38. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    What's your model number of Laptop and was it Vista or XP originally? I just want to glance at the user manual.

    I think it really has to be in the MBR but I can't figure why a clean install wouldn't fix it. I'm still looking around for ideas.
     
  39. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Satellite R15 and XP. Thx.
     
  40. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Just two thoughts:

    In Computer Management>Disk Management on Drive 0 is the partition marked as /Healthy/System in the graph?

    If you edit your boot.ini and just copy the OS line making a second entry for the same partition do you get a bootloader on restart? I don't think you will because I don't think you're getting as far as boot.ini but I want to check.

     
  41. sach2

    sach2 Major Geek Extraordinaire

    These would be links to the Toshiba HWsetup utility and the Common Modules. I'm fairly sure they just give you access to the BIOS they don't change it. You would install the common modules then the XP Utilities. They may help you determine if anything is unusual in Bios.

    The only other thing I can think of is use a different Disc Wipe utility like Boot and Nuke(on UBCD) and try another install.

    Background


    Commom Modules

    HWSetup Utility
     
  42. chaimjm

    chaimjm Staff Sergeant

    Hi Amy you just amaze me with you patience rolleyes I would have bought a new disks days ago :major
    Shalom
    Chaim
     
  43. okn0tok

    okn0tok Private E-2

    Yes it did. I tried the boot.ini file a long time ago and got nothing. Now it qont boot into windows from the cd anymore.... Im not sure what I did haha.
    Going to try a new HD today to rule out the hd although yesterday I ran a disk diagnostic on it and it found zero errors.
     

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