US State Laws on poaching wireless?

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by LauraR, Apr 5, 2008.

  1. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    Does anyone know where you can find laws on neighbors/anyone poaching internet from wireless routers?

    For example...New Jersey State law.
     
  2. joelsz

    joelsz First Sergeant

  3. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    Good article. Thanks :)

    I'm looking for specific laws though. I can't seem to find any sites.
     
  4. Jerkyking

    Jerkyking Sergeant Major

    Laws lag behind technology but I agree its up to the owners. Locking doors is the only way to keep people honest. If your concerned lock down your router.
     
  5. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    Mine is, and has always been, locked.;)

    It's more a comment someone said to me and I would like something tangible to point to.
     
  6. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    AFAIK, there is no clear cut law, but being that some people have been prosecuted sets precedence, and does it make it actionable in a court of law.
     
  7. BILLMCC66

    BILLMCC66 Bionic Belgian

  8. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    Thanks Adryn...that wasn't what I wanted the hear though.;)

    Bill...sort of but I"m looking more for private homes.

    k..here's the scenario (rather than being obscure). I know someone that has decided they don't need to pay for wireless in NJ because they have a few neighbors who have unsecured wireless. To put things in perspective, their view is also that they don't care if people use their wireless so do not see any reason why they shouldn't use someone else's.rolleyes
     
  9. Fred_G

    Fred_G Heat packin' geek

    Here is a link: http://compnetworking.about.com/od/wirelessfaqs/f/legal_free_wifi.htm

    Not exactly what you asked for, but it brings up a point I had not thought about. The person's ISP that you are using may have restrictions (like # of computers on the network) that an unwanted wireless user could violate.

    I have done a little work on some wirless networks, and usually only 1 in 3 available wireless networks have any security!

    E
     
  10. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

  11. Calltaker

    Calltaker MajorGeek

    coming from someone who uses a wireless network at home, I have to say that I feel that the owner of the network is responsible for keeping their network closed, secured, locked, whatever you want to call it. I found someone poaching off me and the next day I encrypted my network and locked it up tight.

    I checked with my lawyer, and he is not aware of any NY laws that have to do with private home networks, and the only corporate laws he knows of are the ones in Westchester county (as noted above)

    As someone who is known for traveling with his laptop and using any open network he can locate, I personally feel that if you choose to leave your network open, you are inviting people to use it.

    I know, this may not seem like the moral high ground, and no, I would not use someone's car if they left it open with the keys in it, but....... If their car was 'borrowed', the police and insurance companies would blame the owner.

    Just my $.02


    ~C
     
  12. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    This is interesting:

    from http://www.timewarnercable.com/nynj/customer/cabletheft/cablethefttypes.html

    So, the law definitely puts it on the wireless owner to secure their network. And as it states, it is a federal law for those who use cable anyway.
     
  13. ItsWendy

    ItsWendy MajorGeek

    It seems pretty simple, and I don't buy the argument that WEP is so weak that you become liable, for the simple reason any home network encrypted like this is directly equivalent to a no trespassing sign. You have clearly stated by using it that it is private property, if someone decides to break in they are the criminals. Blaming the victim of an attack or intrusion does seem to be the american way though, it is another way of saying the real criminal isn't responsible in some fashion.

    I do agree an unprotected network should be fair game, though not for criminal activity. Enabling the simplest of encryptions is easy to do, and declares it isn't for public use.

    The article mentioned the hotel WiFi, if I'm staying at a hotel what is it for? The evil twin scenario was an interesting heads up though.
     
  14. BILLMCC66

    BILLMCC66 Bionic Belgian

    I find it so hard to believe that people leave their networks un-encrypted in todays climate when the main reason for using another persons net is to access dubious sites with anonymity.

    my network is encrypted but a couple of weeks ago a young kid who lives close bye hacked my router,after a long and exhaustive search my ISP sent an engineer with a magic box and all it took was the time to have a cup of coffee to find the kid,the police were called he was cautioned but so far nothing else has been done so it would seem here at least no action will be taken against intruders.
    http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/2649/ishrzkuyofnsqeroxel7qcvob4.png
     
  15. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    lol...I think you have that backwards, Bill. Being a victim and not taking repsonsiblity for you own actions has become the American way. ;) Your statement goes back to that little story, The Boy Who Cried Wolf. ;)




    Well, that's disturbing. How'd he hack it? I didn't even know you could do that.


    I'm mixed on the whole issue, btw. On one hand I do think there is enough info out there that everyone should know that they should encrypt their router. So once in a while if you need to access the internet when you aren't at home and there happens to be an open network, go ahead. On the other hand, to not pay for your own internet and steal someone else's every day is wrong if you ask me.
     
  16. BILLMCC66

    BILLMCC66 Bionic Belgian

  17. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    Jeez, Bill, that really is disturbing. Sorry to hear it happened. At least you caught him, so hopefully he'll stay away now.

    Thinking I'm going to go through Mada's steps he gave you. I actually think I did that long ago when I was reading an article, but I"m going to go back and double check.
     
  18. LauraR

    LauraR MajorGeeks Super-Duper Administrator Staff Member

    So I go to the linksys router addy...Verizon (my provider) had it routed to their setup! wtf

    I already have settings and this is like when you need to start at the beginning.
     
  19. ACE 256

    ACE 256 MajorGeeks Forum Administrator - Overclocking Expe

    I find its the problem of the router manufacturers. Most routers default to no encryption and default to channel 6, the most used channel. If you ask me every router should come with its own WEP or WPA key. Analogous to how every pad lock comes with its own key.
    True WEP is easy to crack but its better then no encryption and why go through all the trouble to crack some ones WEP when there are dozens of unencrypted routers just down the street most of the time? As for keeping people off my router a 50 digit WPA2 key, a MAC address filter, operating on a channel thats only used in Japan (Chan 14), and a 64 digit password for the router its self does the job for me. ;):D:major
     
  20. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    The channel isn't gonna make a difference in security. Remember, only the router is limited by channels, not the wireless cards. Mac filtering isnt either, when I can make my Linux box use any Mac address I want, and it will spoof it. Mac filtering will only stop those who also cant get past the most basic wep key.



    Im not sure that a default key is the answer either.

    I think more like them being required to setup their own wep/wpa/wpa2 key on first boot of the router would be better. A long key with a mixture of numbers, letters and symbols should be mandated.

    WEP should be discontinued altogether. Force people to upgrade for security's sake.
     
  21. ACE 256

    ACE 256 MajorGeeks Forum Administrator - Overclocking Expe

    True, but most cards wont search channals 12,13 and 14 if your set as in the US. The only way one could get past the MAC filter is to know one of the 3 MACs set as allow. That combined with a long WPA2 key makes for a hell of a secure router. Like getting past one locked door only to find 3 more locked doors in your way. Not uncrackable but difficult, more so for the average wireless leach.

    Agreed, even forcing WEP would be an improvement over the default. Make the leach work for it not just click connect and go. :D
     
  22. Calltaker

    Calltaker MajorGeek

    Now I run a WEP key encrypted wireless network at home. The thing is, I also use a hex conversion of an ASCII code that is both letters and numbers. When TW came back out to reconnect me this week, the guy who came out had a laptop with him and checked my security, and even withthe software that TW game him to try to hack my router, he couldn't. Made me feel a little bit better. If it was some kid working from a basement room spending a couple days on it and not getting anywhere I would probably feel better tho.

    I run a Linksys 4 port + wireless router at home, works really well and the price was right (free with a PCI wireless card included). SO I figure that it is OK.

    As to cable theft, that is generally when someone hooks themselves up to a junction somewhere enar their home and runs the cable into their home for private viewing of cable TV. I spent a summer working for Time Warner here in the Cuse and busted a lot of people doing that. I think that the biggest difference is that Cable theft requires you to actively locate and connect to the physical cable line, whereas WiFi 'theft' happens because a network is not secured, and most wireless connectivity programs are set to connect to any available network by default.

    Personally, I feel that some of the fault for this should go to the software comapnies for setting them up to be idiot proof for connecting to a network. Just a thought.


    ~C
     
  23. Triaxx2

    Triaxx2 MajorGeek

    I have the most powerful protection possible for my Wifi network.

    It doesn't work.
     
  24. Adrynalyne

    Adrynalyne Guest

    1. Any of the people who are interested in getting past your security will be able to search those channels.

    2. WPA only protects the connection to the router, not the packets. You data packets can be sniffed, and they all carry a MAC address signature. Thats hacking 101 there.

    3. Thats about the only thing that makes a somewhat secure router is a very long, very random key.

    Not trying to argue really, just trying to open people's eyes into security practices that really don't do a whole lot.
     
  25. DavidGP

    DavidGP MajorGeeks Forum Administrator - Grand Pooh-Bah Staff Member


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