power supply problem ??

Hello,

About a week ago I started having some problems. I decided to first unplug all the additional items (usb printer, etc.) and just left the monitor, keyboard and mouse connected. But then when I went to plug the unit back into the electrical outlet the little green lite on the back of the tower did not lite and I had not power to the pc. I went to the HP website and followed the trouble shooting steps ---

http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/d...=bph06788#N414

which is why I am now thinking that it my be the power supply unit. I was doing some research and instead of just getting a new psu some sites state to test the power supply unit first. Some of the sites suggest testing the power supply unit manually with a multimeter or with a power supply tester.

I do not have a power supply tester so I would have to go out and get one of those first. I do have access to a Simpson 260 VOM. The Simpson 260 VOM (volt-ohm-milliammeters) looks different from the multimeters I have seen online from this one. Primarily because this Simpson unit is much much larger; in a hard black case and is not digital.

Can I use this Simpson VOM to test the power supply? If so is there anything specific I need to know or does anyone know where I can get information on exactly how to do this (don't want to make things any worse than they already are but the closest place to take it in for service is about 40 miles away and I can't easily take the tower in since I am disabled).

Any assistance would be so very much appreciated.

TIA

Lisa

 

You can use the Simpson 260 for testing the PSU, just make sure it's set to DC volts. Take good care of the Simpson 260. Their old but very good VOM,s. I still use one in my shop. They never die.

If the PSU says Bestec on it, it is surely bad. The problem here is that when the Bestec PSU's go bad, about 50% of the time they take the mainboard with them. If you have access to another PSU to try, I would suggest that before spending any money on a new one just to find out the MB is bad.

 

Greetings, lmhjcr.

Those Simpson 260s are good old meters, aren't they? We used them a lot back in the '70s in Army electronics. They're still better than digitals for testing capacitors.

MG member tgell posted a good link in another thread for PSU testing: http://www.hardwareheaven.com/guides/testingPSU/ - the tutorial is using a digital meter, but the procedure should be the same with the 260.

 

Hello Again,

Thanks for getting back to me. The Simpson 260 is actually my fathers and he has had it for as long as I can remember.

Yes, the psu does say Bestec on it - but there is no other information on the unit other than the usual stuff about the warranty being void if taken apart by an unqualified person. It was also stamped with what I believe to be a date (2001 04) - I am thinking it is a date since I got this pc back in May or June of 2001.

I also came across a few sites that suggested doing the paper clip test on it (2 of them being) http://aphnetworks.com/tutorials/psu_paperclip_trick
http://www.overclock.net/faqs/96712-how-jump-start-power-supply-psu.html

I did disconnect everything and tried that but nothing what so ever happened when I did that.

I do not have another PSU to try out first. In fact, if it weren't for the fact that I had gotten this laptop about 18 months ago (when I was having some other issues with the pc and needed access to the internet immediately and couldn't wait) I'd be up a creek without a paddle right now as the saying goes.

Is there any other way to find out if it took out the MB as well? If not, I am guessing that my only other option would be to get another psu and hope that it didn't take out the mother board or to just take my hard drive out of the unit and get rid of it all together.

Any suggestions?

 

Unfortunately, it's very common for the Bestec PSU's to take out the MB. They have poor voltage regulation which over powers the main board when the PSU fails. If you know of a small privately owned shop near by, perhaps they would be willing to try a known good PSU on the machine and see if it's dead or not.

When a computer enters my shop for any reason at all, I open the cover and look for bad capacitors and the name on the power supply. Even if the computer is working but just in need of a tuneup or something, if it has a Bestec PSU, I will not even plug the machine in without replacing it. I do this with the customer there so they can see that I am not just trying to run up their bill. I have a sign on the wall that says "ALL Bestec Power Supplies will be replaced at the customers expense before any work is performed."

 

Hello Again,

Thanks so very much for your input. A friend of mine purchased an HP computer around the same time as I did. I think that I had better let them know and have them open up their unit and see if it too has the Bestec psu in it.

Unfortunately where we now live there aren't any small privately owned shops around (at least none that I am aware of). I will have to ask around and see if anyone else knows of one. The closest place is about 45 minutes away and has a $149 repair estimate/bench fee. It wouldn't be so bad except that it isn't easy for me to get the unit there to begin with which is why I was hoping to fix it myself (if possible).

If I can't find a small privately owned shop that would be willing to try a good psu on my pc for me ~ am I correct in thinking that I can take the hard drive out of the unit and save it (maybe make it into an external hard drive)?

It isn't a large hard drive but there is some private stuff on it that at the very least I would like to wipe clean (taxes, banking information and such). I did make backups with the seagate wizard and I also just copied the information from the my documents folder onto an external hard drive as well but I don't want to just dispose of the pc with that internal drive in there and all that sensitive information on it.

Thanks Again for Everything. You have no idea how much I appreciate it.

 

You could save the drive and get an external HD case. That would make the info on it available by way of USB or Firewire. I would also suggest pulling the RAM and the WIFI if it has that for future use. The RAM may fit a new computer if it's the right kind or else it's worth a few bucks on Craigslist or eBay.

The HD will make a good external drive but it can also be securely erased using many different programs.

 

You have to consider that you have no verification that the mainboard has been damaged.
If you did the power supply test correctly and the fan in the supply did not turn on, you simply know the power supply has gone bad.

How many watts is your power supply? Someone may help you select one from an online seller for a reasonable price that may be worth a shot. Certainly much less than $149 dollars.

 

According to the HP website for what comes in the box and from what I have been able to find out from some research (since there is on other information on the psu itself) --- • Device Type Power supply
• PowerAC 120/230 V
• Power Provided185.0 Watt
• Compliant StandardsEPA Energy Star

It also has the following: Processor
• TypeAMD Athlon 1.2 GHz
• Installed Qty1.0
• Max Supported Qty1.0

Its only has an 80gb hard drive (but still has about 60% of it available; it came with an nVidia Vanta 16 MB videocard and 128 MB of RAM which I upgrade to the maximum allowed which was 512MB SDRAM. It came with Windows ME installed on it which I upgraded to Windows XP Professional a couple of years ago.

I realize that it is 10 years old and isn't very fast but I still use it for some things and as I stated I have stuff on it that is important to me (even it if has been backed up with the seagate disc wizard). I also can't afford to be buying a new wireless printer right now so I had set up a home network so that I could be on the laptop and if I needed to print something (as long as I had turned on the desktop pc & printer) I could just print whatever needed to be printed using the home network setup to print through the printer which is connected to the desktop. Much easier than having to carry the laptop into the other room to print all the time!


Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Again, Thanks so VERY VERY Much for all the help.

Lisa

 

Hi Lisa,

I hope shnerdly can give you a recommendation. My only experience with HP power supplies was with an old Compaq about that age. I took it to a local shop (not sure how reputable) and they only charged about $99 dollars to replace but said something about having trouble getting one that would fit because of Compaq'a proprietary fittings. I don't know if that was true or not. At the time PC's still cost over $1000 so it seemed like a bargain.

Since that PC is so old, I guess the question would be if you want to get a quality power supply with ample power you could possibly use on a future computer or if you simply want a decent power supply with sufficient power for that machine that will not be of much use on a newer machine.

If you give the model number I will see if I can find an example of the original equipment but I am sure others here can find a suitable replacement.

 

I meant model number of the PC. (your original link to HP site does not work to give model number of PC)

Still hoping someone else can suggest a reasonably priced 250w power supply for an HP/Compaq computer that would be worth trying. I'm really curious if there is anything about older HP computers that requires a specific PSU.

 

If the machine is a PIII, I would recommend scraping it over fixing it. Here in Minnesota, you can pickup used P4 computers between 2ghz and 3ghz processors and a gig of RAM for $50 to $75. We're not talking dual or quad core but much faster then a PIII. You could add your current HD as a second drive to maintain your data.

Most of the 5-10 year old HP's were in a compact Micro ATX form factor. The power supply connections are normal but the dimensions of the PSU are not usually normal. They had a very small PSU in some of the PIII's and a shortened one for most of the later PIII's and early P4's. The shortened one was necessary to allow clearance for the CDROM drives. Any PSU with the correct MB connections would work to check the MB but may not mount in the case.

 

Excellent information!

I've always questioned whether I was given accurate information about that PSU. Mostly because I don't particularly like the guy that runs that shop but I was happy with the result. The dimensions of the PSU make perfect sense because I never saw any unusual connections. I really appreciate your clearing things up for me.

****
Imhjcr,

I guess it comes down to whether or not you want to put any money in that PC. I would think topping out at ~$50 would be about the reasonable limit if you just wanted to try to get it running again.

 

Hello Again,

This is a Pavilion 7865 and it has the AMD processor in it. And things are pretty tight inside of this tower. In fact, the information states that the "product form factor is - mini tower". It was a real pain in the you know what to remove the connections to the cd-rom and cd-rw drives since it is in there so snuggly.

I had originally had a Compaq computer which turned out to be a lemon and I finally got my money back on that pc. I went out and got an HP only to find out that HP bought Compaq a few months earlier (wish I had known that before I purchased it).

A friend of mine (who purchased her HP a few months before I got mine) was going to give hers to me since she doesn't use it anymore - but as it turns out she doesn't have that one anymore. Instead she has a slightly newer one with a P4 processor in it that is just sitting around and she said that I can have it. Only thing is that we are in Northeastern PA and she is in WV so the soonest she and I can get together is the end of the month ~ but its worth it.

I'm just hoping that it doesn't have the Bestec Power Supply in it as well and that if need be I can find another PSU to replace it with (also hoping it doesn't have the same tight fitting - mini tower so that it won't be a problem to find another power supply to fit in there).

Now I will just need to see how to add my current hard drive as a secondary hard drive or if I will need to turn it into an external hard drive to maintain my data.

Thanks for all the assistance and once I have this other pc in my possession I'm sure I will have some more questions.

Lisa

 

Hello Again!

As it turns out the pc that my girlfriend was going to give me; which was also an HP Pavilion PC (just a little older and with the pentium processor) had the same power supply in it as mine did (Bestec) so she gave me a slightly newer PC which is a Dell Dimensions 4400 that use to be her brothers and he was going to throw out. It has the Pentium P4 processor running 1.6GHz (however when they purchased it they only got the 20gb hard drive in it). The memory can be upgraded to 1GB (has 384MB installed at this time).

The processor in the HP unit (with the bad power supply unit) has an AMD Athlon 1.2 GHz processor in it and I had upgraded the memory to its maximum which is 512MB. The Hard Drive in this unit is 80 GB.

So now that I have this other unit I did open it up and it is much easier to access the power supply unit (need to go back and look at the power supply unit and see if there is a label on it and what brand/manufacturer this one is)

Anyway, would I take the power supply unit out of the Dell PC and just plug in the cables to the HP PC and see if the motherboard does work or if it got fried when the the power supply went/died? Also, do I need to plug in all the cables or should I just plug the in the motherboard cables and see if the unit will power up or do I plug in all the cables?

If the HP PC will turn on with this other power supply unit I would still need to get a different unit since it will not fit into the HP unit since the sizes are different.

I am guessing that the other option would be to take the hard drive out of the HP PC and install it into the Dell since there is a space to install a second hard drive (this would at least give me more storage space on that unit since it only has a 20GB hard drive in it) and I would then be able to upgrade the memory if need be since it can be upgraded to 1GB. But can that in fact be done since the windows xp professional operating system is on both hard drives and is there anything that I would need to consider if doing this?

Any assistance or suggestions would be Very Much Appreciated.

Thanks Again!

 

Plug in the power supply from the other unit. All the cables. At least you would know if the one you have is bad if your old one boots up. You can leave it hanging outta the case if the sizes are diffrent.

 

If your old HP was a PIII, I would just put the HDD from the HP into the Dell and run it. If you wanted to, you could move your data from the 80gig to the 20gig and then install the 80gig as primary and reinstall Windows if you have the disk. Then move your data back.

The person that originally had the Dell might still have the WinXP install disk.

 

Hello,

Okay, I finally got a chance to open up both pcs and was going to take the power supply unit out of the Dell and try connecting it to the HP and see if the mother board got fried when the power supply unit died in the HP unit.
However, when I was looking at/checking exactly which cables were being unplugged from which part of the pc in both units I noticed that the little numbers that are on the different sections of the cords.

On the HP unit with the dead power supply unit the cable numbered as P3 is connected to the CD Writer; P4 goes to the DVD-Rom Drive; P2 goes to the Hard Drive and there is an additional plug labeled fan which is connected to the motherboard.

On the Dell unit P5 goes to the Hard Drive; P9 is connected to the CD-Rom Drive and P2 is connected to the motherboard (and looks different than the P2 on the HP power supply unit or any of the other connectors on the PSU that is in the HP unit)

Should I still try plugging in the psu from the Dell into the HP to confirm whether or not the Motherboard is fried in that unit with this other power supply unit and since the cable labeled as P2 in the HP unit goes to the Hard Drive would I plug P2 from the other psu into the HD or use P5 which is the cable that is plugged into the HD on the dell? (I hope that made sense).


The HP unit has the AMD processor in it and the Dell unit has a P4 processor in it which is why I was asking if it was even possible to add that hard drive into the Dell unit which does have the space to add the hard drive but with them being different processors I am guessing that there is going to be some conflicts if they are both in that unit at the same time. (could I remove the 20GB hard drive that is in the Dell and replace it with the 80GB that is in the HP or is that going to cause a problem as well?)

Thanks so Very Much

 

On most power supplys I have swapped out. Mostly you can't connect a plug end to a connector if it's wrong. On the M/B connector. Some have a longer connector with more pins and others have less pins and a shorter plug. Difrence on my experience on the 2 type plugs. The last pins on the long M/B connector have ( Think it's 4-6 pins? ) The plug from the power supply will let you slide off the one end to not or use the end pins connecting it to the M/B. Hard drives, Disk drives, M/B connectors usually only go on one way and can't flip them by mistake. M/B has a locking tab you go by. Hard drives and disk drives I have are all red-green-black and yellow wires and only one way to plug them in. Thinking the same voltage to all. Hope this helped. Other here would know a better answer perhaps. Just what I see on mine.

 

Hello Again,

I am so very sorry that it has taken me so long to get back about this matter. Unfortunately there have been some serious medical problems with my parents that take priority so I was not able to take the power supply from the Dell and plug it into the HP to see if the motherboard got fried when the power supply unit died until now. I did so and the HP computer turns on and runs fine with the power supply unit from the Dell computer. Only problem is that it will not fit into the HP Pavilion 7865 tower.

So the good news is that the motherboard is just fine but I am not sure how to go about finding a good power supply unit to fit into the HP Pavilion 7865.

Any suggestions would be so very much appreciated.

I was also wondering if it was at all possible to put the hard drive from the HP Pavilion into the Dell instead of getting a new power supply unit. The Dell does have space for an additional Hard Drive (and the one that is in there is just a 20GB and mine is an 80 GB) They are both running (have installed on them) Windows XP Professional. The thing that I am not sure about is that the HP Pavilion is running an AMD Processor Chip and the Dell has and Intel Processor so I wasn't sure if that would cause any problems if I were to install the HP Hard Drive into the Dell. (the dell has more RAM in it and the RAM can be upgraded as well where as the HP is already maxed out at its RAM and that is less than is in the Dell)

Any Assistance would be so very much appreciated.

Thanks Again

 

Thanks for getting back to me. I sort of figured it wouldn't work if I were to simply put the hard drive from the HP into the Dell pc. I do have a Windows XP professional disc (the one that I used to upgrade my HP from ME to XP professional). I had also considered taking the hd out of the HP unit and converting it to an external hard drive for use with the Dell unit as well but thought that might be a problem as well since I have no way to wipe that hard drive clean first (besides - I really would like to get some of the info off of it first - although I did use the windows xp to make backups as well as the software that came with the seagate external hard drive that I was using for the backups.



I looked at the picture at the link and that is what the psu looks like in the HP pc. I did find another one that looks like it as well at http://www.highpowersupply.com/product-ps-sfx230m2.htm but it states that it has been discontinued.

I have not taken the psu out of the hp tower since it is not so easy to do with everything fitting in there so tightly but I guess I am going to have to try so that I can get exact measurements. With the psu in the tower I did get a measurement of 4 7/8" x 2 1/2" top to bottom + an additional 1/2" for the part of the fan that sticks out (drops down from the rest of the psu) 4" from front to back.

Thanks again for Everything - you have no idea how much I appreciate this.

 

I was finally able to get that darn psu out of the tower (let me tell you - HP does not make it easy to get that unit out of the tower. I had to remove the 2 optical drives in order to do so).

Anyway, on the back of the unit is states HP P/N: *5185-2918*
Bestec Model No: ATX-1523D
OUTPUT RATING 150W (MAX)

At the bottom of the label is also states BST ATX-1523D D2


The measurements are as follows:
3 15/16" front to back
4 7/8" side to side
2 1/2" top to bottom plus an additional 1/2" where the fan hangs down from the psu.

Again, thanks so Very Very Much

 

Thanks so very much for the help and so quickly too!

I hate to be such a bother but I have a couple of questions.

I was looking at the one from directron (since it does have more power) but it does not look like the one that is currently in the HP. Does that matter?

Also - it asks if I want to add a Y-Power Cable; do I need this? The current unit does not appear to have it on it but it does have 2 optical drives, the hard drive and a floppy drive in it.

Thanks Again,

Lisa

 

I haven't read the whole thread but plodr's first link to 911 has a second link to this page http://www.911forpcs.com/3beatposu.html which looks like yours and references your Bestec model number after all the HP model numbers. The difference being that it doesn't have a 3pin fan control but the page says it is not needed with the new supply.

Just pointing out the link.

 

I don't know if you have yet? But test the cable to the power supply,borrow a working one from someone.

Also test the fuse in the plug or just change it out for a new one,you can test the fuse by setting your testmeter to ohms,when you touch either side of it 'the two metal bits' your testmeter should jump all the way up.

 

One thought on the Y connector is that it changes one IDE power connector to two IDE power connectors. So some of the power supplies in the various links in this thread only have three IDE power connectors. If you are currently using all 4 IDE power connectors on your current power supply then if you order a model with only three IDE power connectors you will need a Y-cable to split one of the three into a fourth one.

 

Using your old hard drive in the working computer. A long vidio but gives you basics.

-> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvvM2Ao4Jpk

Once installed, you can explore the old drive to save what you want. The original working drive will be C: The old drive will show as D: No need for a external drive setup.

 

Again, I am so sorry that it is taking me so long to get back to you. However with mom going through chemotherapy again that does take precedence over everything else right now.

Thanks so much for all the help. It is Greatly Appreciated. For the extra $2 I think that I will get the Y-power cable (just in case I need it).

And thanks so very much for the video on installing the old hard drive into the other pc as well. I will definitely look at that as well.

Again, thank you for all your help and assistance.

lnjr

 

Take as long as you need. One way, on if you don't want to transfer to C from D drive. ( Finding something you want to access on D. R/click on the file if I remember right. And make a shortcut. L/click on the shortcut and drag it to the desk-top.

 

Hello Again,

I finally had the time to order the psu and did get it from directron (http://www.directron.com/m6320.html) as suggested (especially since I did not want to get another bestec psu). Anyway, it arrived and does fit right in without any problems. However, the old power supply unit had a cable labeled fan-c and it plugged into the motherboard as well (right there where you plugged the motherboard cable in - depending on how you look at it it was plugged in right next to / above or below that plug). But this psu does not have that cable.

I did contact directron to ask them but thought I would ask here as well since I have always had great assistance whenever I have had any questions or problems and posted here at majorgeeks.com.

Do you think that there is any reason that I should be concerned about this?

I have not plugged anything in just yet since I was not sure (since that plug is missing) and I also noticed that the new plugs do not have any labels on them. The old psu had P1, P2 etc on the different plugs (which I also labeled before unplugging them - just to be sure I plugged the right one back in where they belonged).

Thanks so Very much,

Lisa

 

Good morning.

According to the Directron link:

So, I suggest connecting everything (those P1, P2, etc. plugs should be idiot-proof) and firing it up. Make sure you monitor the heatsink fan - the BIOS shouldn't allow a boot if the fan's not running, but you never know.

 

Interesting,first time I've ever heard of one of those:confused

 

Thanks for getting back to me. Directron did as well and they stated
"These units are designed to fit serveral different HP models and they vary slightly.

The FAN-C connector should just be a fan speed control signal cable. If you do not have that likely the fan in the PSU is managed by the PSU directly instead of by the motherboard. Generally this difference would not cause a problem using the PSU in the system

The other video power connector is likely for a machine other than yours. It does not need to be connected if your machine does not have the connector, and leaving it unplug will not cause the PSU any issues."

so it would seem that there won't be any problems so I am now going to complete the installation of the new psu and connect everything and hopefully all goes well.