I need advice

Hi

Well the line I normally take is similar to the below and by the time I have said all that they are comatose and cannot use a PC to infect themselves

"While you have a security program as in <insert product here> or you may use the likes of Firefox/Chrome as your browser and may think you are secure, sadly you are not for a number of reasons...

1. While and anti-virus application may seem as if its protecting you, it will to a point, as they are not advanced enough as yet to cover all malware bases, they are only as good as the scan engine and virus definition files, yes Huristics do now play a good part but its not perfect.

You can add other free complimentary applications to your security regime as in Spywareblaster, malwarebytes etc, these can lessen the infection rates a little.

You also need to keep these applications upto date also, it the scan engine becomes too old, many malwares can get past them, which is where the crux comes in with retail as in many users do not wish to pay for the yearly updates to application etc so leave their Antivirus to lapse.

2. Keep your Windows and all applications upto date always and if you have a hooky Windows version then your vastly open to malware as who knows what has been done to the code of that version downloaded, warez applications also is applicable to non Microsoft software too.

3. Downloading items from Peer 2 Peer is a huge hole in your security, its not illegal to use P2P but what you are downloading maybe, and all that glitters is not gold, it may come with unwelcome malware, so if you want that latest music album then go buy it from an legitimate download site or music store.

4. Safe surfing is the major part of security, you may have 100s antivirus/antimalware applications installed but they are not going to stop you from downloading from unsafe sites, and once you have downloaded the malware is on your PC. Next issue which is user based is well, porn and other sites... you go there and very likely in many attached to the webpage is malware.

Using Google Chrome or Firefox will not protect you from unsafe surfing and downloading potentially malware ridden files, its a myth.

5. Click Happy - as in if a popup appears on your PC, do you click it without reading, if yo udo then in conjunction with #4 you may well let malware on your PC, read what a popup is and if you don't know, close it down prefereably via CTRL-ALT-DEL over the red X as those popup Windows can be programmed to install malware when clicking the red x.

6. Email attachements, never open from anyone you dont know and never open them from folks you do know if they are chain emails, stating "look here is XXXXX nude" just delete.

If you do know who an attachement is off and its legit, save and scan first, with the likes of Jotti ​

In the end its never going to be as yet foolproof in blocking malware the end user needs to be aware of what is on their PC and what is out of the ordinary, not an easy task to educate end users.


What you could do is produce a small flyer with some basic PC security Do's and Don'ts to hand out.

 

Hi Ned cheers, and good post yourself, I agree with alot of what you said, and at times you are right the big names do play on their name in the field, and hell who wouldnt in business.

But this is where the education part is difficult, try and find info for a novice PC user to follow that spells out all the pitfalls of security a PC and have them actually read it, they wont, and this is where big named brands and PC stores do not help (too much) in they are not tasked to help the end user in PC security, they are tasked with addon selling as in adding full package big brands like Norton and McAfee to a new PC, BUT no aftercare or basic info on security, I've never seen any document with a new PC that spells out security issues.

We are in the information age and internet is global, but OEMs dont add any info to help the novice users.

Its sadly upto small business PC owners and forums like this to try and help, but its always after the fact, we can educate at that part but once the PC has left the shop then its the users and they will likely go back to doing what they did before.


Thats why I think a small educational flyer on the stuff talked about here in this thread and handed out with a repaired or new PC from the likes of you guys/girls could just help in a small way, with...

The pros and cons of security and do's n donts etc and with a list of what security apps you have installed and update scedules to the apps if auto or manual and what to do if manual, when the licence period is up and what to do for the likes of Avast if thats installed, when to use CCleaner etc

Reason I mention a flyer is that you can add your company name/name and contact details as this is good advertising as well as informational.

 

Cheers Baxter and great to see a really good topic to get our heads around and I feel an important one also.

I agree on some applications being taken off as in SAS and MBAM, HJT etc as they could be too difficult to use for some, less confusion the better.

As for MSE I do like the app (not that I deal with MSFT alot but I genuinely think they got their act together on this one) and a good one to add as it auto updates both the app and defs from WU.

As more technically challenged users we have to try and make things simple for novice users as all they want is the PC to work, but as I have mentioned earlier some education is needed, hence the flyer approach.

 

Allow me to give you a quote from Chaslang:

 

Good stuff Baxter

 

Yes I agree and where most of my posts where going as you state "low end" user will not deal with the nitty gritty of wanting to secure a PC, but in the end this may become a definitive for ID theft and fraud!

Thats not going to happen and in a perfect world it may, given 200 yrs into the future, but the here and now, sadly the user is pretty much left on their own, no company wants to take ownership.

Microsoft will only go as far as Windows, and if you add 3rd party apps then your on your own as they maybe the security risk, Google Chrome, its open source and as such is open to anyone altering the code, is that safe opposed to Apple Safari and Microsoft Internet Explorer?

Issues also arise from new apps not being conformist as in Chrome, Firefox as to what the majority have been used too in IE, is that the fault of anyone.... personally I think NO as we all adapt in out lives to circumstance so technology should be no different.

Its a minefield and I think education is key but who is to administer this???

 

Yes to Colemanguy's option, and don't forget I will have likely typed that post in 5 mins and not digested the info for multiple days or 1hr plus to come back with a that is the wrong suggestion and as we all know their are multiple ways to close/stop or end applications and a PC from working, I could have suggested just pressing the power button for a hard shutdown, but that would be overkill.

Having sad that any of the suggestions for ending a browser pop up are a waste of time as a novice user is not going to know them anyway! and that is the point of this thread, no matter what a geek we are and knowing that pressing Shift+Alt+spinning around and howling at the moon, is not going to work to prevent malware.

 

Hi sandi

Yes that was and is my fav method of malware removal in howling at the moon and spinning around like a loon! dunno if it works but sure makes the user laugh!

No solution seems final, there are solutions and many techs or tech savvy users use them, but for the novice users its a really bad situation in that they are not ever told of pitfalls of PC security and internet security by the vendor. In many cases they are just sold as a retailer bonus payment a 3rd party general antivirus app in Norton or McAfee, is that good enough though?

I think not and my voice on this is lost in the background noise of big vendors.

Linux is a superb option but many will not move to it as its a different option and menus and GUI etc, and some scared of suing it due to the name and old thoughts of its a "geeks" OS, and not easy to install.

TBH the install of Linux and especially the likes of Ubuntu is great the OOBE is fantastic but the problem for many is the lack of compatibility with Windows type apps, but in the main man use MS Office and Open Office for Linux will suffice, email is not an issue as is Internet access, so main pitfall is gaming!

Now that is the best quote I have seen in ages, and I totally agree with you in that do not discount an OS or app as its new as bad, many do sadly and the old XP vs Vista/7 adage comes to mind, and like you if you do not like Windows and for some openly post they hate it, well then try Linux and see how you get on, you have a choice!

BUT back to malware, well thats a minefield and the user is the main issue, in what they click on and download, no matter how good the AV apps are they cannot account for the person behind the keyboard.


PS. I use 5 types of Windows at home (XP, Vista, 7, WHS and Server 2008) plus Linux Kubuntu and Mint, so dont really care for the OS but I like the tech of them, prefer Windows for ease of use and apps I need, thats a preference thing only.