Here We Go Again.......

Trump needs to fund Coal Fuel Cells to complete his promise. That should revitalize the coal industry and provide cleaner power. Coal Fuel Cells will not stop CO2 production, but it's a step in the right direction.

 

Here's 30 guns already and possibly more taken off the streets in this area. Pills, dope and counterfeit money also.
A not so legal gun owner busted!

http://www.mypanhandle.com/news/inv...rugs-30-guns-and-counterfeit-money/1034320246

 

Good stuff. Actually enforcing current laws would help more, in my opinion, than passing more laws to 'do something'.

http://www.politifact.com/new-hamps...eople-trying-buy-gun-illegally-us-senator-ke/

Maybe getting more serious about enforcing current laws on the books might cut down on some of the guns getting into the wrong hands.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipe...rearms_transaction_record_5300_9revised_0.pdf Note first part of the form...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_4473

 

Well said!

Ditto.

 

Thoughts go out to Santa Fe High School in Texas
https://www.theage.com.au/world/nor...after-reports-of-gunfire-20180519-p4zg8i.html

It has been a while since the last one but still...............

 

Words of a school shooting survivor Missy Jenkins Smith who was shot and paralyzed in a school shooting at Heath High School in Paducah Kentucky.

How do we stop the school shooting epidemic?
Some think the solution is to ban certain guns. Or require background checks. Or arm teachers. Or hire more resource officers. Or install metal detectors. Or strengthen our mental health resources. Or focus on character-building at home and in schools. Or…
You know what? Like just about every other significant problem in the U.S., there usually isn’t a one-size-fits-all solution. There are more than 300 million people in this country. A solid fix for your school or community may not be the best one for mine.
Several factors have to be taken into consideration through honest and difficult discussions among school, government, and other community leaders who don’t necessarily agree with one another…discussions that are fruitful and result in compromise.
Sadly, we are living in a time when many people push their own agendas instead of trying to find common ground.
They refuse to listen to others long enough for compromise to even be considered. There is no listening, no empathy, and, therefore, no action. Until this mentality changes, especially among our politicians, shootings like the one yesterday at Santa Fe High will continue. What is it going to take for our leaders to change the way they think?

Mr. President and Senator McConnell, will you both please consider meeting with me and other school shooting victims to discuss how we can end this epidemic? I’ve been trying to make a difference since I was shot and paralyzed 20 years ago in Paducah…but it's not nearly enough. I need your help. Please.

Sincerely,
Missy Jenkins Smith
Murray, Kentucky

#DonaldTrump
#realDonaldTrump
#MitchMcConnell
#SenateMajLdr
#McConnellPress

Missy Jenkins Smith: I Choose to be Happy
https://missyjenkinssmith.com/
https://www.facebook.com/Missy-Jenkins-Smith-I-Choose-to-be-Happy

 

Yes. The GOP is owned and or intimidated by the NRA. Other countries have grappled with gun violence and have a measure of success. The second amendment is just that, an amendment. It can be amended, modified. It is far too easy for criminals and mentally unstable people to buy guns in the USA. I wish you all well as you tackle this serious issue.

 

"Fall on deaf ears" is not new just to this administration. Missy spoke before Congress soon after she recovered enough to travel to Washington probably 19 years ago. So let's spread the blame across the powers that be.

 

Indeed! I am curious to see if voters want change. US voters have a chance in November to make changes.

 

I wonder what Missy Jenkins' ideas are to stop breaking laws. As far as Obama and Trump, the President is the Executive branch of the gubment, blame should really fall on the Legislative branch. That is if you think a group of people who can't seem to balance a checkbook CAN write a law that will prevent crime, when no law does that perfectly anyway, or we would need no jails.

I went to a gun event this weekend, and heard some interesting theories on school shootings, but I keep wondering, if someone is so deranged to do such a thing, what law would stop them? Kinda like a suicide bomber, many of these shooters get killed, or know they will be in jail for a very long time, so it seems wrong to try to write laws that restrict normal people's rights to deter a lunatic.

London is trying 'knife control' now? https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/04/09/london-mayor-knife-control/500328002/

As far as the Congress being bought by the NRA..

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...mocrats-christian-schneider-column/372679002/

Odd that little was in the news about this school shooting that was stopped. https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/20/us/maryland-school-shooting-resource-officer-response-trnd/index.html

 

I don't think she claims to have all the answers she just wants something to be done.
Missy Jenkins Smith is a school teacher, author, survivor, and a motivational speaker who's platform is to stop school bullying.
In her own words:
Her position on gun laws:
Smith says, “Basically, I try to steer away from some of this discussion.” She says her position is this:
“As far as my opinions when it comes to guns, I have family members who use guns. My family owns guns for hunting. For me personally, I don’t want to use a gun or have anything to do with one, but I believe they must be
RESPONSIBLY taken care of. My 10-year-old son and his dad go hunting, he learns the appropriate way to use a gun, and we keep our guns locked up in a safe. If guns are responsibly taken care of, I don’t have a problem with guns. But, if they are being taken care of irresponsibly, and if people are getting their hands on guns who should not have them, then that’s when there’s a problem.”
Smith believes that’s what happened in the Heath shooting. “Michael had a friend whose family owned guns, they didn’t put them away properly, and I think that he had the ability to access them and they didn’t know the guns were gone. Your own responsibility as a gun owner is huge.”
When asked about people with mental illnesses, whether they should be allowed to have guns, Smith says, “I think that as far as mental illness, some people are not capable of using guns. I do not know enough about the different types of mental illnesses. Perhaps someone who has schizophrenia, who was not taking their medication, might do something that is not okay. There are too many what if’s and possibilities, so I can’t fully answer that question.”

Missy "I am a teacher, and I do NOT want to carry a gun in school.BUT…let’s keep open minds as this national discussion of how to make our schools safe continues.
We are all going to hear ideas we like and don’t like: teachers carrying guns, armed guards at each school,
raising the age that people can purchase guns, banning certain types of weapons, having metal detectors. Every idea can be debated. Let’s just remember to listen to each other when involved in one of those debates.
I recently visited a school in another state in which I was told a handful of the faculty members carried guns.
They were all well-trained and comfortable with the responsibility of defending students in that manner.
I never thought I’d be okay with that, but it took me back to when I was shot, and all of the guns and ammo Michael had, and how nobody could do anything about it until Michael chose to set the gun down. Michael could have killed every one of us if he wanted to. Knowing that there were people at this school I recently visited who had my back if a situation like Paducah arose was somewhat comforting.
Again, carrying a gun is not something every teacher can (or should be forced to) do. It is certainly not for me. But I will keep an open mind to every idea. There may not be a one size fits all. Every campus is different, demographics are different, we as humans are all different. Let’s listen to each other and respect each other as we try to find
common ground to protect our kids, which is what this discussion must continue to be about."

“"We must redouble our efforts to protect all our children from violence and make sure our schools are free from violence and the means to wreak it.”"
"The quote is from President Bill Clinton the day after I was shot…in 1997.
Nothing has changed in more than 20 years."

 

Thanks Katkat. I think she brings up great points.

I don't think any sane person is wanting to require anyone to carry a gun if they don't want to. I would never support such rules. The 2A does not say you have to own or carry a gun, and I would totally support anyone who was not comfortable carrying or using a gun.

Not much of a grade curve when guns are involved.

Opiods are killing a lot of people. Do we ban pharmacies, or find out the root cause, and solve that issue.

Should not be a law in my opinion, but parents that own guns should be more responsible.

 

As a shooter Fred makes many well considered points and and some of these are at the core as to why change isn't about to happen.

This is something that can't be factored into any general rule because lunatics don't follow the rules and often don't care whether they live or die.
Many times Fred has put forward the argument that why should law abiding citizens be penalised by new laws limiting their legally sanctioned gun ownership just because there are a few mass shootings. What I suggest is still allowing people to have guns but limit all assault/semi automatic weapons or anything over a certain power or calibre unless they have a special need. It is the powerful rapid fire weapons that are mostly chosen for the mass shootings and limiting these seems a small price to pay if it reduces mass shootings.....just sayin....

This I think is central to having any level of success but law enforcement and the federal legislators are going to have to work together to get a good outcome and they will need to be consistent across all states so people can't dodge the rules in another state and carry on unchanged.

Arming more and more people with guns........ I don't think is the solution either and especially having teachers charged with protecting the students against a shooter.....I bet when they signed up as a teacher they never thought they may have to do weapons training then risk their own life to protect their students. Having armed guards doesn't do bugger all either as has been illustrated when the security guard ran away and hid at Sandy Hook. Tim summed this up below......

The real solution will come down to limiting access to high powered automatic and semi automatic weapons and making it difficult to own these weapons without having a genuine need to own them.
The gun culture also needs to change as too many people will grab a gun to settle an argument rather than trying more peaceful methods of settling the issue so this needs to change and I think education is the key.


The reason I got back up on the soapbox is that with heavy heart I have to say one of Fred's points has just happened here in Australia. We have some of the most restrictive gun licencing laws and and restrictions on gun ownership and even still we have had the biggest mass shooting since Port Arthur in 1996. The Port Arthur massacre is what triggered gun control here and sad to report there has been a mass shooting in Margaret River, Western Australia last week. It is a murder suicide and 7 people, 4 children and 3 adults, are confirmed dead. Initial investigations suggest the grandfather shot family members with his legally owned and licenced guns. Sad times for the remaining family and friends and sending best wishes.....
https://www.theguardian.com/austral...ns-at-scene-belonged-to-childrens-grandfather

 

Totally agree with this joffa: "The real solution will come down to limiting access to high powered automatic and semi automatic weapons and making it difficult to own these weapons without having a genuine need to own them."

 

It's interesting you bring up opioids. We severely restrict access to them because of their dangers, Fred. We shouldn't waste our time on that because criminals ignore those laws, right?

 

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
Edmund Burke

 

Yep Trump is all talk and do nothing so the article has no surprises.........the rest of the world treat him like the joke he is......lucky he has the NRA on his side so he will have a few votes

 

This approach to solving problems is great for lawyers and politicians. But the Swiss have the real answer; education. Military service as a condition of citizenship? Mandatory gun training for all residents? Many decades of gun possession laws has done almost nothing. The US cannot eliminate its gun problem any more than it can eliminate its drug problem by trying to prevent access.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ip-why-doesnt-no-mass-shootings-a8230606.html

 

My friend is a Captain with over 30 years experience in the South African Police Service.
She has to leave her service pistol at the station because she doesn't own a safe.

 

Owning a weapon in Australia means you must have and use an inspected and approved gun safe at all times. The gun safe is to be made of 6mm steel and must be mounted out of plain sight in a cupboard or similar and be secured to at least 1 structural wall member and 1 structural below floor beam by hi tensile bolts that cannot be cut, ground away or removed from outside the safe and which must be protected by an operating burglar alarm and at least one security rated 5 lever lock. Law enforcement both federal and state can inspect your gun safe at any time of the day without notice and they don't require a warrant. The onus is on you to demonstrate that all guns and ammunition are stored in the locked safe and your mandated burglar alarm is operating. Failure to do this will result in confiscation of your weapons and heavy fines. Every gun safe is physically inspected and checked at least once every year and sometimes more often.

My friend, who is a champion pistol shooter, says the police check his two gun safes on average every three months and sometimes it is at 5am in the morning and other times at 11pm at night............... but he owns 4 pistols and 5 rifles so is deemed to be a good target for burglars.
The police check the safes at odd times so it is a complete surprise search and people can't cover up if they haven't been locking their weapons and ammo away according to the law. My friend copped a fine and a show good cause why his guns shouldn't be confiscated when he accidentally left 20 centre fire rounds on the bench beside his reloading press (they were hidden under a sheet of paper). He packed up and locked away the other 500 rounds he had just reloaded and he missed the 20 rounds under the paper. He was fined AU$400 and issued with a warning and had to make a sworn statement as to how it happened and what he would do to prevent it happening again.

 

My point is simple. Gun free zone, assault, attempted murder and murder are illegal. How many more laws are going to stop someone? Heroin is illegal, but pretty available around the country.

More kids are killed in car wrecks than school shootings. If we ban guns, then like drugs, criminals will still get them.

 

Neither were automatic weapons. Automatic guns are not commonly available. Revolvers are not semi automatic guns. So, in this case, banning auto and restricting semi auto guns would not have applied.

 

Perhaps trying to rewrite the Constitution is why he was an associate justice? Should we add "when serving in the interest of the government" to the 1A? And then you would also have to define militia.

Katkat, sorry, edit timed out, here is the link for the quote I posted above about the guns used by the recent shooter. http://time.com/5282754/santa-fe-shooting-suspect-dimitrios-pagourtzis/

 

And they should also be charged.

 

Yes, I actually do have a dictionary. You might consider looking up humor, or sarcasm. And what does Trump have to do with this?

 

What would you have them charged with? And how far would you go with this? Should people be liable for anything they own that could be used as a weapon? What about cars? What level of security would make one safe from people trying to steal guns or weapons? What is the real problem? Guns, tools, lots of people are killed every year by feet and hands.

At what point do we stop blaming the tool, and investigate the people misusing the tool?



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D33T4GOtB-U

 

Again, let me remind you, Executive, Legislative, and Judicial branches of government. The Executive branch is not supposed to make law, that is the Legislative branch's job.

Might stop. Or might not stop. And how would expanding background checks help with kids stealing guns from parents?

And please, don't don't think I do not believe guns should not be secure. Gun owners with kids have to consider that while their kids may (or may not) be safe with guns, they will have other kids over, who might have nefarious goals.

 

I'm not an American or attorney therefor it's not for me to decide.
I'm sure the lawmakers don't need my help.

With rights come responsibilities and not just the responsibility of using a firearm or driving a car, but also the responsibility of ownership.

I am all for gun ownership.
I'm also aware that the majority of mass shootings were not committed by teenagers with ARs.

https://www.vox.com/2018/2/27/17042228/age-limit-guns-florida-shooting-ar15

Here's an interesting read.
http://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...-will-not-solve-mass-killings-24975?page=show

 

I really don't understand that there is any reason for such a discussion. There is a pretty simple logic behind: If noone has a gun then there is no risk to get shot down by a gun. The risk grows in the same way as the number of guns that private people own.

The argument that people need weapons to discourage other people from offenses is not valid. Everybody has a knife at home. Following this strange argumentation means everybody needs a gun to prevent other people from attacking with the knife. If everybody has a gun we should legalize tanks to prevent other people from attacking with the gun? Finally atomic bombs would have been legalized, too. Bull***t! Guns don't belong in private hands.

Steffen

 

Is it the intended purpose for a car to run someone over? No!
Is there any other purpose for a gun than to wound or to kill? No!
Obviously there is a difference.


Let's go back to the initial post. Mass shooting at school.
I'm used to use the 5-Why method to get the original root cause.

Why did a student got a gun to shot down people?
Because it's easy to get a gun.

Why is it so easy?
Because owning weapons is legal.

Why is it legal?
Because weapon lobbyists have a big influence.

Why do the lobbyists have such a big influence?
Because they have enough money (don't want to say more).

Why do they have so much money?
Because they earn a crazy amount by selling weapons. And they can't get enough. And the more weapons they sell the more do they earn. And the more they earn the bigger ist their influence ...

So where is the failure? In my "(don't want to say more)".

 

Making all guns illegal will possibly get guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens but will not get them out of the hands of criminals.
@Fred assault semi automatic guns may not be the weapon of choice in school shooting but it does seem to be the weapon used in other mass shootings, like Las Vegas and many more for example.

There is not one answer to fix everything. Still we have to figure out how to make children in school as safe as we can. Pronto! What ever that takes. A place to start is to stop bullying in schools. Zero tolerance!
To do nothing has not worked. Past time to do something!

 

5-Why again?
Why do so many criminals have a gun?
Because it's easy to get a gun.
The rest is the same as above...

 

GermanOne obviously criminals are not getting their guns legally.

 

I agree that making our kids safe is priority No 1

I am 53 years young and bullying in schools was big data even back in the day when i was 13.....only one thing has changed!
When we walked out the school gate, it stopped once we got home.
Today, the advent of social media and online communication applications, allows it to continue late into the night until bedtime with any connected device.
Zero tolerance inside schools wont help.

The Internet, Social media, violent movies, parents with lax security who own guns, Grand Theft Auto and other first person shooter games all add to the confused illusion of fantasy, as opposed to real life for these confused and angry kids.

Strict gun laws in Australia have really done nothing to keep guns out of the hands of hardened criminals, but maybe......just maybe, it has helped a little with stopping our kids gaining access to them and fulfilling some twisted fantasy.

If dad cant keep a semi-auto under the bed, little johnny cant sneak off with it to school while he's asleep or at work!

 

Tim I was answering germanone's question as to why criminals have so many guns.
I agree with social media, violent videos and irresponsible parents being at fault. Still think bullying is a start.

 

It's easy to get a gun in a land full of guns. Getting it legally or not was not my point. What difference does it make for the dead?