Mr Mum and single parenting...

Balancing work and parenting is no easy task, but when it comes to work and single parenting, that can be even tougher.

What annoys me is the discrimination that is sometimes directed towards men if they need to try balancing work hours (eg leave work early to pick up kids; kids home sick), in particular if they are single parenting.

I believe in equal opportunity which applies to women/men alike.

So any sort of discrimination irks me particularly if work is threatened or if snide remarks are made where men are:

• stay at home “Mr Mum” for whatever legit reason, (eg other half earns more; or simply because there’s mutual agreement dad stays home to look after kid(s) while mum works
• or a single parenting dad

Don’t you think such men should not be discriminated against?

 

I'm still doing that routine, although the last chick is ready to fly (well, maybe not, but I don't have to supervise an 17 year old like I did when he was 9). I've been pretty lucky, but I did have to take a lower paying job to get a workable shift. 2nd Shift (2PM to 10PM) is not an alternative for single parents of any stripe, 3rd shift is managable.

 

That's one of the things that irks me. There should be some flexibility with work to adjust accordingly (where viable of course). I've seen too many people go down in pay as you did to accommodate times needed.

 

With me it was lack of work, the company I was working for collapsed. I spent a year looking for another job. Had several good nibbles, but they all wanted the new guy to be on the 2nd shift.

 

I had a boss give me flak once, because I took a 5 day weekend when my wife gave birth to our second son. Because it was a cesarian, I figured we would need a few extra days. The boss says 'What is the big deal? Women give birth all the time, and are on their feet right after." I suggested we cut him open from side to side, just to see quick he gets back on his feet. That job went south fast after that.

 

The posts I've read so far are fast making my temperature rise. What I've read here falls under discrimination:

Unbelievable! Don't they have leave for this? Even Compassionate Leave?

Here we have the Human Rights and Equal Opportunity Commission that applies for legit reasons and within the workforce. Surely your governments have something similar that applies to all workplaces? Or is it simply that people aren't aware of their rights?

 

Legalsuit- Yes, you are entitled to leave for certain occassions, like birth, death, and illness. However, it is also common to get fired for doing so, they just don't give that as the reason.

 

Sounds like organizations you are better off getting away from. If you want to make money in business it helps loads to be people oriented. Sounds like these jokers, jerks, aren't. Word of mouth is also a good way to drum up or drum down business, sounds like these employers deserve all the bad mouthing they are getting. Glad you kept names private, I'd sure like to give those people a piece of my CPU.:mad
Bug
:tas

 

Been there, and done that for 25 years, or so. Add to that caring for a disabled wife and brother (who I'm still the Carer).

Let's see, also caring for an aging father (who has since passed on), and transport, cooking etc., etc. for the rest of the family. All I got was discrimination and criticism. Hey, I'm not expecting rewards or compliments, or even help, but heck, if people and the 'system’ can't/won't help, at least I’d hope that they'd not make it four times as hard as it needs to be rolleyes .A long story, which I won't go into, but there you go.

Oh yeah, not to forget, running several companies, and doing the Consulting Chemist work in addition to the above. My 'reward' was to get deserted, supposedly for some kind of better deal (which, of course, didn't happen, eh rolleyes). Takes all sorts, I guess.

I’m still getting life together, after that little epic saga.

 

The Equal Opportunity Act 1984 (WA) aims to ensure everyone has a “fair go” and specifically prohibits discrimination on the grounds of family responsibility. As a carer, you're covered by this Act and entitled to lodge a complaint.

Given these are private issues, rather than my broadcasting further on this Forum, if you haven't already done so, you may want to check out http://www.humanrights.gov.au/contacts/index.html to make some enquiries and get some directions if you're still experiencing problems/discrimination.

 

Thanks for the link. Yep, matters are pending in National and U.N, Human Rights Commission & High Court of Australia. As I'm not an isolated case, there may also be class actions involved. It will be a complex and lengthy (read costly) process, My foreign status also adds to the mix.

As I consequence I am prohibited from commenting further. There is much more to these issues than meets the eye, so you'll just have to watch for it, when it eventually enters the public arena, as it surely will, in time.

Some factions think it's just going to go away or I'll give up. That's Not going to happen. Also dependent on other parties, at least in part. Enough said.

 

That commonly happens here as well...doesn't stop people from lodging complaints to the appropriate authorities who then do investigations. No company likes that.

I'm familiar with difficulties employees encounter with discrimination. They often are too disheartened to complain/put up a fight. To "expect it of everyone" is not good enough reason when employees have legit reasons.

I've worked in corporate environments and American based companies, so I'm familiar with expectations and the long hours involved for career paths. But with flexibility you can still do the work by balancing working from home and at the office (if that's the route you want to take and which many women/men do for family responsibilities where viable). So it all falls back on the company. If it is viable and the law is broken then the company has no say.

Legit discrimination shouldn't be tolerated and that's not my feelings or opinion but the law. You'll find the basic laws touching on human rights has an international foundation.

 

Hi Legal
I think that you should give yourself a big pat on the back for what you are doing and be really proud of the fact that you are standing up and being recognised for what you are doing
Men and women are equal and in todays' working environment, and I believe that if an employer treats you any differently, they should be named and shamed :mad

Grumbles

 

There is a law here called The Right To Work Law. In short it means you can quit a job at any time for any reason with no repercussions. In turn you can also be fired at any time for any reason with no repercussions. Unless you are in a Union or contracted/salaried then things change.
I may be missing something here but, why should my employer bear my personal responsibilities? Companies succeed by having people work for them, not by having people work around them.

 

I'd like to think that any employer with a soul can understand that there will be times that the family needs you. Just like when the company needs you to work extra. While it isn't fair that they need to cover for you regularly, stuff happens. Like any relationship, there needs to be a little give and take.

 

Well, on the whole - most Employers don't have a 'soul' when it comes to business. They are there to make as much profit as possible. If they don't, they won't be in business for very long. Employing humans is minimized, as they are expensive to run (employ).

There are exceptions to this, I've had some bosses that have become personal friends of mine, but these are very much the exception, not the rule. One of several reasons I run my own companies, these days. Family reasons, as mentioned previously, was another major factor.

 

Your post made some good points, but too many to break down here without getting too technical legally and losing an audience with responding, particularly since you're in a different country.

Only point I'll touch on is re contractual employment. Then employer/employee is bound. However, unconscionable conduct by either parties will not go under the radar as far as the law is concerned.

 

LauraR there are different issues and the law looks upon it on an individual basis. Employers are covered just as much as employees. There are some shoddy employees out there who try to wrought the system and these get sorted out also.

However on Evilfantasy's point: why should my employer bear my personal responsibilities - employers can be reimbursed in certain ways if they properly understand how to run their business. And it still stands there are:

• rights entitled to staff
• employer's have many legal responsibilities and duties towards their employees and same applies to employee towards their employer.

That said, it depends on the type(s) Evilfantasy refers to which is not clear here to expand upon.

 

Don't ever give up. That's what other parties always depend upon. Believe me, tenacity counts...(and that's one of my strongest points too).

 

As of 5 Months ago, my first born son popped out, I had a career shift and am now a stay at home Dad. (Wife makes FAR more than I ever did). I asked my old employer for Paternity leave...they asked me if I was actually having the baby, and if so I should be in the newspapers. Otherwise "Denied".

I'm sorry, but it was MY first baby as much as it was my wifes. I had just as many sleepless nights changing diapers and warming bottles as she did (and maybe a few more since I was working too).

Let's be serious though....who cares! No one cares about anyone elses circumstance unless they've been through it. That's the bottom line on most things.

Shoot, I'd just be happy if they'd put changing tables in more mens restrooms...sure is a pain when I take my 5 month old out to lunch. Last time I went to a restarant without one, they told me (casually joking of course) that next time I should bring my other half. I proceeded to change him on the dinner table for the world to watch. I told the waiter maybe they should be mindfull of who they're serving if they want to stay in buisness. (He didn't get a tip)...lol

 

And all of this is why I am self employed. I finally found an employer that wasn't a... *insert your favorite explicative here*. Yeah, they expect you to drop to your knees and kiss their backsides, do whatever they need, and no, they don't care about you. I feel the same about them, and wouldn't raise a hand if the building caught fire with them inside. Ok, maybe I'd get some popcorn.

 

There are too many factors being discussed to expand on. Discrimination takes on many, many roles. Each case is unique. I am not trying to defend anyone who has violated someones rights.

The original topic of paternity leave is hard to nail down. In the USA each State has different laws and each company has different policies. Taking sick leave is normally viewed as acceptable when it is for your child. Mix sick days with vacation days and I have never had a problem keeping my home life and work life from conflicting with one another. But, my life is unique to anyone else. This is me.

No company can stop a man from taking all of the time he desires to raise his or anyones child. That doesn't mean they have to pay you or hold your position while you are gone. If it is a small company then I would think they would have to replace you. If a large company, I have seen people leave (in the correct manor) and return some time later. That is if done correctly. Set a time frame, talk it through, get it approved.

 

Agree with your post as your comments outline the most common sense type approach and do vary by country/State laws. Company policies are always taken into consideration and in fairness employees are also expected to play by the rules. It can't be one sided.

I know of people allowed one year's leave but only upon mutual agreement of return terms irrespective of company size. I've also known of companies taking employees to court and rightfully too.

As a general rule, companies have to outline leave types and time allocated to each type of leave. Going beyond these agreed parameters requires negotiations by individual.

Rights boil down to common sense, open communications and mutual agreements to avoid problems. Sometimes a viable solution is for an individual to make up time taken and employers appreciate and see this as fair play, so they reciprocate in kind. Employers have rights too.

 

As Evilfantasy pointed out, laws can vary by State and how company policies integrate with the law. Even though I don't know the laws where you are it still sounds as though the basics of Equal Opportunity weren't applied in your case.

Re changing rooms/tables for babies, many places have areas for changing baby's nappies (doesn't have to be solely in female areas). It takes community pressure to make these sort of changes (same as with wheelchair access).

And Bravo! for being a Mr Mum!

 

Thanks Grumbles! Surprisingly not many men think that. It really irks me reading how some dads have been treated in these posts.

 

What about Family Leave, its like sick time or vacation time? My youngest son was in the PED ICU for a month with the RSV virus and I had to stay at the hospital with him and my mother took Family Leave to stay with my 3 and 7 yr. old.. Are you a single parent and/or a stay at home dad?
If you are both then there are lots of resources for you. I'm a single mom of three and one of my children is Autistic. He was injured by HIB b vaccine. DON'T GIVE YOUR BABY THE FLU SHOT!!!!!!!!!!!! It contains thimersol (mercury).
If you had been a single parent and adopted a child you would qualify for paternity leave. Right??? I think so.

 

Well, I am a stay at home Dad, so that wouldn't work. But more importantly (and just like the previous fella's said)... They told me I could take unpaid leave for up to 6 months....but my particular company did not have any kind of paternity leave.

I will give them a minor excuse and say they are a 'stereo typical' company from the deep south of the US. You know the kind - Mom, Apple Pie, Dad works a Manly job, Mom's in the kitchen. Honestly, that was part of why I quit.

I am SO not that stereo type (I'm from Chicago, I dance, sing...and game...my wife on the other hand plays football and all that) so that company didn't have a clue how to relate nor did they care too. They (unoficially of course) believed that modern family situations were unravelling the fabric of our country...blah blah blah.

I disagree....Guys like Phantom.....they're the real deal. They're the ones that give me the ability to tell my employer to take his job and ....er.....give it to someone else....(trying to be hospitable here). Thanks Phantom for paving the way , even if you didn't have a choice about it. Now guys like me do! W00t!:major

 

Thanks Aaron. I just did, and continue to do what I have to under the circumstances. Be nice if things were different, but since they aren't all that can be done has been done. I know you've done your dad proud, too in all that you've achieved. Take care, all.

 

I think it is awesome that you're a stay at home DAD! Being a stay at home parent is way harder than any job! Most men don't do it because they couldn't handle it! I would give anything to be able to work out of the home! Of course as the number of children increases the job gets harder. When I just had one is was a cakewalk compared to now. My oldest is Abby she is 8 going on 20 and Grady is almost 4 and he is autistic. His vocab. consists of 3 words, which is very frustrating for both of us. He has to climb everything, and I mean everything. He is very smart and has a photographic memory. If he was outside long enough.he would figure out how to get on the roof. My youngest is Josh he is 2 and the biggest cry baby I have ever seen. Sometimes I am convinced that they are all working to suck the life out me.
Sorry about that I guess I needed to get that out. Anyway I think it is cool that your a stay at home dad.

"Only Spartan women give birth to real men, ..."

 

Sorry to hear you have had so much to deal with, and I can only offer praise to single parents (male/female) and more so when they lovingly carry the additional load of caring for children as you have of an autistic child.

Laws vary country to country as well as State to State, so I expect rulings on types of leave would vary accordingly. This is something you should check within your own area. Here, community legal centres offer free professional legal advice regarding your type of queries, so I expect you should have the same type of services where you are which should be able to address your queries.

Cheers

LS

 

Thank you, it is unimaginably hard. He is and all "special" children and adults bring you love and joy that is so pure. They are not tainted by the ugly things in this world. It is hard but I wouldn't want him any other way.
I made a movie of him, for him.

http://video.google.com/url?docid=3186828193882560177&esrc=sr1&ev=v&q=grady%2Bautism&srcurl=http%3A%2F%2Fvideo.google.com%2Fvideoplay%3Fdocid%3D3186828193882560177&vidurl=%2Fvideoplay%3Fdocid%3D3186828193882560177%26q%3Dgrady%2Bautism%26total%3D1%26start%3D0%26num%3D10%26so%3D0%26type%3Dsearch%26plindex%3D0&usg=AL29H21zn-PqgIn9q8rntURQsAflXwrqNw

 

Thanks for sharing the movie of your beautiful child.

I can't add anything more because you already said it all in your above post, except for - Thank you for being that special mum and the person that you are.

Cheers

LS

 

Even if theres less ways to poke fun, it isn't any easier being a single mom. Especially one with no family support. It's a great way to lose jobs or not be hired for them if it's found out in the first place. I've been doing it since just shy of 20, and it's been a fist and nails fight the entire time, especially being a single YOUNG mother of a child with special needs, because what can you possibly know? THEY'RE the doctors....

I feel you. But I don't think it's man or woman they're descriminating against, it's the kids.

 

Wenchie, even though I have seen and heard these things regularly, I still feel anger and frustration against failing systems. I hold people such as yourself with great respect for the intestinal fortitude and determination to keep going against such odds.

As you stated, it goes against what's good for the kids, but thank God for people like you.

It takes a lot of community awareness and persistence to achieve a loud enough voice for things to change...though not fast enough.

 

You all rock in my book! The worst thing I can complain about is the lack of changing tables for fella's....hehehe.
Although at my local mall I came across an interesting place. A 'Family' Restroom. There was a men's room, and women's room, but then there was a Restroom for Mom's and Dad's with small children and a place to feed them!
Hat's off to the fella who thought that one up!

 

Wow, a Family Restroom, thats cool!!!!

 

That's the type of area I was referring to in my earlier post. I've seen them outside Mall's as well...(particularly in places where the community has come together and raised a rackus to Council for this sort of need).

Cheers

LS