PC shut down while playing certain games

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by jamesz, Apr 22, 2012.

  1. jamesz

    jamesz Private E-2

    I got this pc from amazon from a company call cyberpowerpc. I got it around late December 2011.

    I can not identify the cause....
    The games that i am able to play without my pc shutting off are : dungeon fighter online.. Skyrim for pc and A.V.A online.

    Games that cannot play : vindictus, blacklight:retribution, and counter-strike.
    as i mentioned, i got the pc around late december. I live in Vegas, pretty hot and cold. When i first play counter-strike back then.(still winter) the pc doesn't shut off by it self. Now i can barely play for 10minutes. I am not sure this is heat problem. Because when i first play vindictus, which is was around late march(still cold weather ) i can play for hours. But on nnone of those hot day and now (90F degrees) my pc shuts down around 20min of gameplay. On blacklight:retribution, it shuts off my pc in less than 5 minutes, i just recently got this game too.
    I also did the furmark test for GPU or something. My pc shut off in less than 30sec. And i thought it was my gpu overheating, but thats not the case. On furmark, there is the GPU monitoring tool: GPU shark, it monitors my temperature and fan speeds. I left that runing and got on blacklight:retribution, after couple minutes pc shut off, before it shut off the temperature was 53C.
    Most of the time when pc shuts off, it doesn't feel like burning hot, it definitely felt like less than 60 degress.
    What confuse me is it only happen to certain games. The pc won't shut off if i just web surfing or listening to music.
    back in Febuary-ish my room temperature was 65F-ish now its 83F-ish.
    When it shuts off, it felk like someone just press and hold the power button, mouse light and internet adapter light all when off.
    My pc has 2 extra fans on the case.
    the grahphic card has only heatsink.

    here are my specs.
    motherboard:Xtreme design motherboard M4N68T-M V2
    Processor: amd athlon (tm) ii x2 270 processor 3.4ghz
    graphic card :amd radeon hd 6450 heatsink only
    8gb rams
    window 7 64-bit
    PSU :turbolink switching power supply atx-cw420w 500watts

    Help Please :cry
     
  2. Goldenskull

    Goldenskull I can't follow the rules

    I would say first check out your Bios and see what the settings are usually they have it set up to shut down if the Temp goes above a certain temp.
     
  3. Digerati

    Digerati Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Then it certainly should still be under warranty and I would advise you to contact their tech support immediately to (1) get on record you are having this problem and (2) to ensure you don't do something that might void the warranty.

    When did the problem start? Have you made any changes to the default HW Monitoring settings in the BIOS?

    If you are overclocking you should reset all timing until this is resolved.

    You are describing classic heat related symptoms. You also live in a dusty, desert environment where there is typically a large temperature swing just from day to night. While the ambient (room) temperatures play a major role in electronics cooling, generally if the room is at a "comfortable" temperature for humans, the computer should be fine.

    Note too, it is the responsibility of the case to provide a good front-to-back flow of cool air through the case. Gaming is about the most demanding task we can ask of our computers. If you only have one case fan (not counting the PSU fan) then you should consider installing at least one more large (≥120mm) fan.

    While you can check the temps in the BIOS Setup menu (as well as the shut-off thresholds - if enabled), it should be noted that running the BIOS Setup menu is about the least demanding task we can ask of our computers. So if temps are high in the BIOS Setup menu, there's a problem.

    I would urge you to monitor your temps when you are using your computer with a hardware monitoring program. You should have been supplied with the motherboard's utility disk - that should contain a monitoring program. Also popular is SpeedFan, or I use and recommend CoreTemp for newer Intel and AMD64 CPUs.

    Are the vents, fans, heatsinks and boards clean of heat trapping dust?

    Note a flaky PSU is a common cause for sudden crashes, shutdowns, or reboots. If me, and the case interior was clean and I had good cooling, I would swap in a known good PSU and see what happens - if that did not void the warranty, that is.
     
  4. jamesz

    jamesz Private E-2

    I have not change any settings in the BIOS, in there, it saids the CPU is around 48C and Motherboard is at 30C

    My computer's hardware have fan for each of the components, and 2 extra fan on the case,so i don't think heating is the problem.

    Here is an interesting thing. Whenever i play CERTAIN games it shuts down my pc, the monitor instantly went black.
    If i do a normal Start>Shutdown, or press and hold the Power button to shut down. My monitor will first go lighted blackscreen with colorful "no signal", then a compelete no-power screen.
    and this only happens with certain games, i can play other games for like ''ever'' without shutting off.
    this makes me think its the PSU problem..
    now im going to clean my PSU and see what happens
     
  5. gman863

    gman863 MajorGeek

    I would also check to be sure you have the latest video card driver for your PC. The best place to do this is the graphics card mfr. site (www.ati.com) PC mfr. web sites don't always have the latest video drivers posted.

    As Digerati said, this should still be under warranty. If you attempt to take the take the PC apart yourself or change out internal parts, the mfr. may use this as an excuse to try to void yourwarranty.
     
  6. rmyere

    rmyere Private E-2

    Yea I would definitely agree that the two things you should do would be to try and swap out a new PSU...and also check to see if your warranty is still good. But it souds like a classic case of a faulty PSU.
     
  7. Digerati

    Digerati Major Geek Extraordinaire

    If not the PSU - and if it works fine with other demanding games, then it may not be the PSU - then I would look at your RAM. You can test RAM using one of the following programs. Both require you to create and boot to a bootable floppy disk or CD to run the diagnostics. Allow the diagnostics to run for several passes or even overnight. You should have no reported errors.

    Windows Memory Diagnostic - see the easy to follow instructions under Quick Start Information,
    or
    MemTest86+ (for more advanced users) - an excellent how-to guide is available here,
    or
    Windows 7 users can use the built in Windows Memory Diagnostics Tool.​

    Note that software based RAM diagnostic tools are good, but not conclusive. So you might try running with just a single RAM module to see if it fails. Repeat process with remaining modules, hopefully identifying the bad stick through a process of elimination.
     
  8. jamesz

    jamesz Private E-2

    Here are some additional problems regarding the pc.

    Sometimes(occasionally) i get blue screen of death when starting the computer, If i restart my computer, it goes away and boots fine..this is an old problem.

    So if RAM is the problem( i read somewhere that ram can cause BSOD), it would make sense.

    ill try to test my RAM asap this week.


    I can almost conclude that heat is affecting some hardware component in my pc. if i start my pc fresh, i can play the shutdown-games for a bit longer. But when i was playing the shutdown-games, i use speedfan to monitor, every temperature seems normal before the shutdown. I am thinking heat is affecting some hardware that speedfan cannot monitor.
     
  9. Moviotion

    Moviotion Private E-2

    Maybe it is overheated. Check the temperature and see if it is getting very high during game. Also, maybe the thermal compound has gone bad.
     
  10. Digerati

    Digerati Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Possible. Is the interior clean of heat trapping dust? Are all fans spinning?

    You could try opening the side panel and blasting a desk fan in there to see what happens.

    TIM - thermal interface materials - do not "go bad", wear out, or otherwise lose efficiency AS LONG AS the cured bond is not broken by removing the cooler or bouncing/rough handling of the computer - especially with a computer that is only a couple months old. TIM can easily last 10 years or longer if the bond remains intact.
     
  11. jamesz

    jamesz Private E-2

    I took out the side of the case and put a fan beside it.
    The problem IS heat. I am able to play the shutdown-games without shutdown.

    While i was playing, i notice my Core temperature is a bit higher than the rest of the temperature in SpeedFan. The average temperature of GPU and CPU and other stuff are around 40C no more than 43C. The core temperatre spikes From 42~50 while other temperature stay constant.

    My computer isn't that dusty.. The case is pretty big its AZZA 202EVO Orion.

    The Core temperature is around 30C when idle
     
  12. Digerati

    Digerati Major Geek Extraordinaire

    It may just have to do with the "sampling" rate between the two programs. If CoreTemp takes more samples, it may be catching the spikes. Either way, 50°C is nothing to worry about.

    But those temps were with the desk fan blasting in there, what are they with the case closed and dependent on case cooling? As I noted before, it is the responsibility of case to provide adequate cooling. But without hands, or a credit card, that leaves it up to you to add more fans! ;) Note too good cable management helps improve air flow - or rather good cable management impacts air flow less. A tidy rat's nest is still a rat's nest. ;)

    Also, there are many many heat sensitive components inside the case besides the CPU and GPU. The "system" temp - which generally refers to the "chipset" or "northbridge" needs to stay cool, as do many of the heat generating and heat sensitive devices that surround the CPU socket to take advantage of the CPU fan's air flow (yet another reason to use the OEM heatsink fan assembly). And any component can have a microscopic flaw in materials or construction that may shorten its life by increasing its sensitivity to heat or excess current caused by heat.

    The specs on the version of your case sold at TigerDirect show one 80mm and two 120mm case fans - with one placed nicely at the top rear (thanks to bottom-mount PSU). Is that how yours is configured? Are all fans running?

    I have found side panel fans don't always work as desired. Instead of helping, they sometimes create too much turbulence inside the case and actually hamper the desired "flow" - essential if you want cool air in coming in. While monitoring your temps, you should try it with the side panel fan running and not running and see which is better. Every case is different, supported motherboards come in all sorts of sizes, and there is no ATX standard for CPU or other critical component placement - other than I/O ports or slots that are exposed to the case's exterior. So, I would try it both ways and go with the one that provides the best performance. If no difference, then I would leave the fan off. This reduces the demand on the PSU, but also reduces fan noise - a good thing.

    And for the record - at least from my limited experience, cases that use a tube to vent the side panel fan's air flow directly at the graphics card/PCIe slot, or directly on top of the CPU are effective at providing extra cooling, without disturbing the flow through the case.

    If you case is running with two 120mm case fans, and perhaps an 80mm too, that should be good enough. I am afraid this may be pointing another weak or failing component on the motherboard, graphics solution or the PSU.

    :eek Please don't open the PSU. There are no user serviceable parts inside. You can attempt to blast out any dust however. I go outside and blast the insides out with an air compressor while using a Popsicle stick to keep fans from spinning - the bearing are designed to spin at those speeds. For those who don't happen to have an air compressor set up for blasting electronics (or dentistry, cake decorating/air-brush painting) nearby, you can use cans of compressed dusting gas, though they are not as effective. But don't open the PSU. Anything that plugs into the wall can kill.

    That said, I note the specs for your graphics card recommend a minimum of 400 watts for a PSU. Your PSU is rated at 420W. Note where your's says "atx-cw420w 500watts", the 500 is a marketing gimmick :)(). All PSUs provide a "peak" power that is considerably higher than their true ratings. But they cannot sustain that without quickly overheating and shutting down out of self-preservation.

    While technically, your 420w supply should, in theory, be enough horse power, even with 8Gb of RAM, it does not leave much wiggle room - especially as it and the computer ages. A struggling PSU often results in erratic voltages, resulting in sudden reboots, system freezes or shutdowns.

    From a troubleshooting standpoint, I always want to ensure I am feeding my electronics good, clean, stable power so before I spent more time, I would swap in a known good PSU with ample power. In your case, I might suggest just buying a nice 550W - 650W Corsair or Antec supply and use that 420 for testing fans.
     
  13. jamesz

    jamesz Private E-2

    Thank you for all your help Digerati, and everyone who reply.
    i don't know the exact problem, but yesterday, i use a big fan and blow my pc for a few minutes with both case covers off. Unscrew the PSU and blow a couple breath into it. Then i went on and play my shut-down games with a smaller fan and i thought its a temporary solution.
    Today, i put my case cover back on and try to play the shutdown-games without the small fan. It worked ..!!! the pc didn't shutoff.
    SO i guess the problem was either dust in PSU or motherboard, not quite sure.

    The temperature without the small fan but with the case fan is somewhat less than 10C except for GPU, GPU temp is around 55C ish, not a problem :D
     
  14. Digerati

    Digerati Major Geek Extraordinaire

    Not likely. Note that 10°C is about 50°F. It is impossible for any fan to cool anything lower than the ambient (room) temperature of the air it is moving. Unless you live in a refrigerator, I doubt your room temperature is that cold.

    So either 10°C was a error in your typing, or the sensor is bad, or the monitoring program is confused - a common problem.

    Let's hope it was dust. Note it may also have been a loose cable connection somewhere - I would check them all.

    I normally recommend inspecting case interiors monthly for dust build up and fan operation - cleaning when necessary.
     

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