Please Help Create Multiboot: Windows 7, OpenSUSE & KolibriOS

Hello everyone,

I'm not entirely sure where to post this, so if I'm in the wrong section please tell me. I'm tasked with creating a triple boot setup using the OSs mentioned in the title. All operating systems must be installed on the same drive with a fourth partition to be accessible by all 3 (for sharing of files). The triple boot MUST be done using the Windows 7 boot manager, so EasyBCD and other managers are out of the question. I'm in desperate need of help as I've never even heard of the latter 2 operating systems and need it done by Tuesday if possible. This is very important, so any help what-so-ever would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

Hi,

I'm only thinking about this so I don't have the solution.

But a couple questions have come to mind. One is that BCDedit is just a program with an easy to use interface to change the actual Windows boot loader. So using it to change the bootloader options would still be using the Windows bootloader when finished.

Is this a school project that has specific requirements? The reason I ask is that KolibriOS is a tiny OS taking only about 3mb. Now mostly it would be used from a floppy or CD. It can also run in parallel with another OS sharing the same partition. Is it a requirement that it be on its own partition?
Also, I haven't actually installed Linux for several years but if I remember correctly it needs a separate partition(s) for swap files or such so it actually takes more than one partition. I don't think these extra partition(s) have to be primary partitions but I believe it/they have to exist which would push the number of partitions on the drive above the 4 you listed.

I just want a better idea if your requirements are musts and you have to limit yourself to 4 total partitions and if Kolibri must be on its own partition.

 

Thanks for the assist sach2. Yes, It's the beginning stages of a college project. We were asked to do this without any prior teachings of where to start, so I'm on my own. One of the requirements is to install KolibriOS to a partition. We have to show all the OSs listed and bootable at startup using the Windows 7 boot loader.

 

I know nothing about Kolibri as it seems very limited. I thought I was going to have some time today but it didn't work out that way. I still think Linix(OpenSuse) will want a separate swap partition which will bring the number of partitions above 4 but I am not sure you have a choice unless a Linux person can give advice. Unless there is a strict limit of 4 partitions, I don't see why that would be a problem.

From what I see Kolibri has some limitations. It can only read NTFS partitions but cannot write to them, so I think the fourth/shared partition would have to be FAT32 if Kolibri must write to it.

If I was going to try then I would create a small FAT32 primary partition for Kolibri as the first partition on the drive 100mb-1gb. Then create the second primary partition 40-100gb for Win7 formatted to NTFS. Then a third FAT32 partition for sharing files say 32gb (FAT32 so all three OS can write to it. Size of <32gb because that is the limit for a FAT32 partition). This partition could be extended logical since it for data.

Then I would install OpenSUSE and let it take over the unallocated space on the disk. This is where it would decide if it needed a swap partition and create it automatically.

Then you could install Win7 and tell it to use the NTFS partition. It will write the MBR and make OpenSuse inaccessible but that can be fixed with EasyBCD or manually using bcdedit commands.

Kolibri just needs files copied to its small partition and mtldr file which will also have to be referenced by the BCD file and edits made. http://wiki.kolibrios.org/wiki/DualBoot_Kolibrios_with_Windows_NT/2K/XP/en This guide is for XP's boot.ini file but it gives a link to the mtldr file which needs to be on the partition and then later pointed to by the BCD.

Those are my first thoughts. I did things in that order because of my uncertainty how Linux will want to install. Letting it take over the unallocated space before installing anything else seems to be the easiest way as far as it creating the partitions it needs. If the shared partition had to be at the end of the drive then you could create a dummy third partition (large enough for Linux 10-40gb) and a fourth partition for sharing. Then delete the third partition and again when installing let OpenSUSE take over unallocated space but it would be in the middle of the drive.

My sizes for partitions are just random but Win7 really needs a minimum of 30gb even if you are testing on a small HD.

 

Can this initial 3 partitions be made using the Windows 7 installer? Or using fdisk?

 

I was just looking at guides on the Windows7 installer but it is unclear if it will let you format to FAT32. I don't think it will. Fdisk won't let you format to NTFS (I don't believe).

OpenSUSE should include Gparted. So if you write the CD for the OpenSUSE installation or put it on USB flash drive, you could run it directly off the CD/USB and use gparted to do the partitioning. Then restart the computer and again boot to the OpenSUSE CD/USB and this time let it install to the unallocated space.

Otherwise there are many partitioning software that can be written to a bootable CD and used for the partitioning. Partition Wizard has an ISO file available which can be written to CD and booted from to perform the partitioning. Scroll down the page it is last download for bootable CD. http://www.partitionwizard.com/download.html
http://www.partitionwizard.com/help/create-partition.html

 

OK, I'll download Partition Wizard and burn it just in case I have any difficulty using Gparted.

You have no idea how helpful you've been sach2. I was on the verge of giving up due to the lack of info online and in the real world. But thanks to you, I now have a good chance of getting things done. I'll post my results or any issues I come across in the morning. Thanks again.

 

You're welcome.

If I can find time tomorrow, I am going to play with it too. I only did a small experiment with Kolibri but didn't try to install it to HD. Plus I didn't have a PS/2 mouse you may want to find one because Kolibri won't recognize a USB mouse. I don't know for sure it has to be on the first partition on the HD but I think that may be a limitation because that Wiki specifically states to put it on the first partition. It doesn't say why but it may be a requirement.

I'm downloading OpenSuse now (I'm just getting the 700mb CD version) to see if it has gparted. This is just the first guide that came up. Be aware you want to create Primary partitions for Kolibri and Win7. The shared partition doesn't matter but going extended might be wise since it does not need to be Primary. http://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/gparted.html#mozTocId801746

Let me know how you get on and if I find any problems with my initial plan I'll let you know.

 

OK, I followed the steps you suggested. I used a utility on a CD I had laying around called Smart Fdisk to create the partitions (2GB FAT32 primary for KolibriOS, 50GB NTFS primary for Win7 and 20GB logical for shared). I then installed OpenSuSe, which shrank the 20gb partition to 6.5gb and used the rest of the drive space for the install (hard drive size 120GB). I'm sure I missed something during the setup process (now there are 6 partitions, the 3 stated before, another yet 2GB partition, an 11GB and 42GB).

I then installed Windows 7 to the 50gb partition. All went smoothly. Now viewing within Windows 7, I see just the main 50GB Win7 partition (C), the 6.5GB shared partition (D) and the 2GB KolibriOS partition (E). I copied the mtldr file from the link you posted to the E drive along with the files from the floppy disk image on the site.

I tried editing the boot manager using BCDedit, but was unsure about was exactly to do. I tried entering the following commands...

bcdedit /create {ntldr} /d "KolibriOS"

bcdedit /set {ntldr} device partition=E:

bcdedit /set {ntldr} path \ntldr

bcdedit /displayorder {ntldr} /addlast

Tried restarting, and while I see KolibriOS list, I get an error when selecting it. I haven't tried setting anything up for OpenSuSe as yet. Not sure how to proceed with it as it doesn't have a drive letter assigned to it.

 

Yes, I had a devil of a time installing OpenSUSE because it kept shrinking my partitions and making my Win7 partition too small for install. (I only had an empty 40gb HD so I kept getting not enough space even though tecnically that is enough.)

I haven't installed win7 nor Kolibri so I can't help on the BCD yet. I think in your commands you want to substitute mtldr for ntldr. (ntldr is for XP, Kolibri apparently uses mtldr)

I'm going to install Win7 and then see about Kolibri. I'll check back when I get 7 installed.

BTW, Win7 will only show partitions/drives it understands in Computer. To see the layout of your HD and all partitions go to Start/Search and type disk management and hit enter.

****
What I ended up doing on the partitioning was to create these partitions and then tell OpenSUSE to use the ext4 and linux-swap for install. That way it didn't change any sizes.

500mb FAT32
22gb NTFS
6gb ext4
2gb linux-swap
6gb Shared

 

I thought adding linux to the BCD was a one click thing in EasyBCD. Not that simple. I haven't used an installed Linux for quite some time and always use the grub bootloader. Never actually used the Windows bootloader for Linux.
I won't get back to this for a couple of hours but will post back later tonight.

 

OK no problem. I'll keep doing some research and see what I can come up with.

 

Sorry, I have had very little luck. It has obviously been too long since I actually installed a Linux distro.

I only got OpenSUSE loading again by using EasyBCD but I don't think that will work for you because it adds it's own little file in the root of the Windows drive which then loads SUSE. So I don't think that will fit your requirements of not using an EasyBCD utility. One of my problems was that I installed Grub but OpenSUSE just changed over to Grub2 with the last release. So grub really messed things up for me. You don't want to working with grub but grub2.

I only played with Kolibri for a half an hour but it isn't booting for me. I only get a few symbols at the top left of my screen and then it hangs.

I'll take another look at this. I had no idea it would be this difficult to use the Windows loader.

I'll just upload a copy of my current BCD but realize that most of these entries aren't working. Win7 loads and last one loads SUSE but it is using EasyBcd's \NST\AutoNeoGrub0.mbr file which probably doesn't count.

 

OK, play around with the boot loader and see what I can do. Didn't even get the time to mess around with it since yesterday, but I'll have more time tomorrow. I too had no idea it would have been this tough.

 

I think I am going to have to give up on this. I simply can't get Kolibri to boot from HD. It works fine from CD but I just get the few odd characters when booting from HD.

I just wanted to give you a link to another BCD program that is just a GUI for bcdedit but I still sort of like. http://www.boyans.net/ And his Linux guide (although I didn't have much luck) : http://www.boyans.net/DualBootWindows7andLinuxOrUnix.html

And SuperGrub2Disk will just get you back into SUSE but that doesn't really help much with the Windows bootloader. Download page: http://www.supergrubdisk.org/category/download/supergrub2diskdownload/

I'd really be interested in your final solution. Or would be happy to help troubleshoot if you run into a particular problem.

 

OK no worries. Even if I just get Windows and openSUSE to dual boot, I'll be fine. This entire thing turned out to be more stress than I think it's worth. I'll give Visual BCD Editor a go. See how things work out. I'll still post here if I run into any issues. Thanks.

 

OK, so our lecturer gave us the to exclude Kolibri if we can get it up and running. Also, we can use another boot manager if we're having problems with the one he asked us to use. But I'd still like to use Visual BCD at the most as it's still using the Windows boot loader. Only problem is that I'm not to sure where to start. Any advice?

 

Let's see. I figured out that my problems with Kolibri were limited to the old machine I was using to play with this. Kolibri just didn't like that machine as to booting from HD. It booted right up on my regular machine and was easy to add to the Windows boot loader.

I used the Vista.bat file in the Kolibri download folder to install an entry to the bootloader although manually isn't very hard. I placed mtldr and the kolibri.img in the root of the first partition (S and it booted right up. Had you tried this and if so what did you get?

I've attached my BCD. Note that partition S: is actually my System Reserved partition which is why it says Windows Boot Manager. I just did this for convenience since the partition already existed at the front of this drive and the Kolibri files would fit.

I'll take another look at adding Linux to Win7's loader. I was so frustrated with Kolibri that I had given up on this project. But Kolibri seems easy enough if it likes your computer.

 

I ended up reformatting the drive and installed Windows 7 first and was now about to install openSUSE in an attempt to at least get things to boot with the Grub boot loader. But after reading your post, I'll try to get Kolibri working before proceeding.

So I tried the way to said and Kolibri was indeed detected. Only problem is that when loading, it freezes at 'Search partitions on disk device'. Have you had this problem?

 

I'd have to reload from CD to read that screen, from HD I think it goes too fast. I think when booting from CD on that other machine it paused just after that with a message about CPU. If I gave it a few minutes it eventually loaded up. Give it a couple of minutes on that screen and see if it will finish loading. (I realize it should be much faster than that but it may not like your hardware either.)

 

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I reloaded from CD on the other machine and my screens don't match any of your messages but I think you are just in a different part of the boot process since our messages match in that they are in the fundamental parts of identifying devices.

I think Kolibri doesn't like your test machine. If the assignment is just to show a BCD that reflects how to start the various operating systems then you have already started Kolibri but it doesn't fully load because of hardware considerations.

I think using Grub2 as the boot manager will still have the same hang with Kolibri but may be easier to get all three OS to boot. (Kolibri will still hang but it suffices as to getting it to begin loading. The BCD should be correct. Or the grub bootloader files will be correct.)

At this point you have two OS loading Win7 and Kolibri although Kolibri won't actually fully operate on that machine but the BCD is apparently correct.

Do you want to continue getting Win7's bootloader to recognize SUSE or do you want to use Grub2 as the bootloader?

 

I started over yet again and now I'm using the Windows 7 loader. I'll stick with this seeing as I have to document the steps and already did so. Right now I'm trying to figure out how to configure everything using Visual BCD. I configured Kolibri. All that's left now I openSUSE. Hope I can get this done. It's due in a few hours.