Strange problem with XP Pro Services

First of all, thanks in advance if anyone can help me with
this one.

specs:
PIII 500mHz, 512Mb RAM, 80Gb Seagate hdd,
SB Live Value! audio card, ATI Radeon VE DDR
graphics, Broadxent v.92 PCI Fax Modem,
LG CDR/RW, OEM DVD-ROM, IOMEGA Zip
CD-R/RW, IOMEGA 100MB Zip disk drive,and a
KDS Visual Sensations VS-720 monitor.

OS:
Windows XP Pro. CD with a winnt.sif file added
for automated installation.

PROBLEM:
Ok, I've never seen a problem with the services
quite like this. I did a clean install of XP Pro, and
only SOME of the automatic services will load
on startup. As an example, my Avast anti-virus
service will not load on startup...in fact, only 6
services load: Event Log, PnP, RPC,
System Event Notification, Windows Audio, and
Windows Management Instrumentation.
However, it is not that the other services don't
work, they just won't load on startup.
And yes, I have the ones that should load on
startup set to Automatic (I didn't tweak the
services before this happened).

On the same note, when I try to acces anyything
that requires the WMI services, a "fatal error" message
comes up even though WMI is loaded. An example
of an operation that needs the WMI services to work
is the Advanced settings under any Network Connections
connection. When the Advanced Services tab is
clicked, instead of showing the information/options
it shows this:
Windows cannot display the properties of this
connection. The Windows Management
Instrumentation (WMI) information might be
corrupted.....


I've installed XP on here several times before and never had this problem. Any help to solve this one would be
greatly appreciated. Also, in case anyone wonders,
the winnt.sif I added to the CD only provides the
XP Pro registration key and doesn't perform any
other automation (repartitioning, etc).
Oh, and I am logged in as the Administrator (it's
the only account).

I'm really stumped with this one...

 

Ahhhh, the wonders of unattended installs, I'm a fan of them myself, to add custom themes, and fonts to my installs....

Ok, getting off track.

When you say WMI is started, which WMI service are you referring to?

There are three:

WMI Performance Adapter
Windows Management Instrumentation
Windows Management Instrumentation Driver Extensions

In regards to the auto-loading of the services, I can only assume that because its a clean install that SOMETHING in the winnt.sif is messing stuff up.

Have you tried setting these services manually in the registry? It could be that the services snap in is not working properly.

The services are located here:

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services

If you look in the Services snap in, you will notice that when you go into the properties of a service, it gives a Service Name:


Start types:

0x0 (boot)
0x1 (system)
0x2 (automatic)
0x3 (manual)
0x4 (disabled)

 

I know you got this covered Adryn, but I'll throw this out there anyway. Probably doesn't apply to a clean install.
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;319101&Product=winxp

 

Adrynalyne,

First off, thanks for responding so quickly.
Secondly, sorry I didn't make which WMI I was
referring to more clear.
In the example I gave of an app that was having
problems I did say that it was Windows Management
Instrumentation though.
I will try modifying them from the registry, but as far
as the initial settings are concerned, according to the
snap in they are all set correctly.
Since this may not be the problem, any further
suggestions would also be appreciated.
I'll get back with the results of the registry mod
in a few minutes.

Also, here's a copy of the .sif file I'm using, though
there shouldn't be a problem since 95% of it was
created with setup manager:

[BEGIN WINNT.SIF]
;SetupMgrTag
[Data]
AutoPartition=1
MsDosInitiated="0"
UnattendedInstall="Yes"

[Unattended]
UnattendMode=FullUnattended
UnattendedSwitch=Yes
Repartition=Yes
OemSkipEula=Yes
OemPreinstall=Yes
OemSkipWelcome=1
TargetPath=\WINDOWS
WaitForReboot=No


[GuiUnattended]
AdminPassword=*
EncryptedAdminPassword=NO
OEMSkipRegional=1
TimeZone=35
OemSkipWelcome=1

[UserData]
;PID marked out for privacy in post
ProductID=?????-?????-?????-?????-?????
FullName="XPUser"
OrgName=""
ComputerName=XPComputer1

[TapiLocation]
AreaCode=912

[Branding]
BrandIEUsingUnattended=Yes

Home_Page=http://www.google.c... [END WINNT.SIF] Thanks alot, RJS

 

Here is mine for comparison:

;SetupMgrTag
[Data]
AutoPartition=0
MsDosInitiated="0"
UnattendedInstall="Yes"

[Unattended]
UnattendMode=ReadOnly
OemPreinstall=Yes
OemSkipEula=Yes
TargetPath=\WINDOWS

[GuiUnattended]
EncryptedAdminPassword=NO
OEMSkipRegional=1
AdminPassword=*
TimeZone=*
OemSkipWelcome=1

[UserData]
ProductKey=(deleted)
FullName=*
OrgName=*
ComputerName=*

[Shell]
CustomDefaultThemeFile="%Systemroot%\Resources\Themes\Plex Style M4 (New TaskBar).theme"

[Identification]
JoinWorkgroup=WORKGROUP

[Networking]
InstallDefaultComponents=Yes

[Branding]
BrandIEUsingUnattended=No

[Proxy]
Proxy_Enable=0
Use_Same_Proxy=0


I posted it here for easier comparison.

 

Nah I dont got it covered. This is a problem that I've not seen in the entire time I was an XP tech.

I emphasize was

 

Ok, I checked the registry and all of the settings
were identical to the ones in the snap in.
Also, to make sure that the registry was being
updated properly I turned a couple of the settings
on and off from the snap in while I had regcommander
open and it updated them each time. So, the snap in
is working fine.

Also, in response to Alanc, I just read the article and though it does come very close to this problem, it's not quite the same. Noteably, I do not have an error
message popping up every 30 to 60 seconds.
However, when I checked my running processes
I did note that Winmgmt.exe is not running. I'm
not sure if it's supposed to be or not, but, I don't
have my computer setup to be a server so I don't
believe it should be.

Adrynalyn,
It's nice to know that when I finally do have a
problem I can't figure out that an XP technician
hasn't seen it before either. At least I'm not
boring you with an old "been there, done that"
scenario.

Also, I think it's worth noting that, asside from
the Advanced optoins tab under a network
connection and a couple of other places (I'm
not quite sure which off hand), I'm not having
any real "problems". There are no error messages,
blue screens, or the sort. I did just remember
though that when I tried to install pdf995 (a
program that converts docs to pdf's via print)
it installed but I couldn't print anything even
after I started the printer spooling service.
(That's another service that won't auto load).
Though there's no critical problem here, it's
really a pain to have to turn all of the services
on each time I start the computer.
Sorry I rambled a little here, but typing
while I'm thinking helps me scrutinzie the
thoughts I'm having more closely.
One I just had is to try setting all of the options
to "boot" instead of automatic...that may get
them to run, though it would not be a proper
fix. On the other hand, it could have serious
effects if they can't load during boot-up.

Any ideas about what shouldn't be set to
load on boot instead of auto?

Thanks all,
RJS

 

Wow, must be rather obscure then.


How does the 2K support compare to XP?

 

I wonder if the logon properties are screwed up.

Check this tab on an affected service.

 

More difficult, much to my surprise. I thought they would be similar. Most people who call in are on domains or Novell networks, which complicates things. People who call in for XP are usually home users


What is cool; those who pay the big bucks get whatever their little hearts desire, even if we don't really support it

Even if that means digging around inside the box itself and changing jumpers.

Its a challenge, and I am no longer bored

 

Ok, I am off of work for the next three days, I am sick, its (crap its already Saturday) now, and I've got nothing better to do than sift through stuff like this. If I dont look at it right now, I'll look at it when I wake up from my Nyquill induced coma.

Microsoft Product Support's Reporting Tools
http://download.microsoft.com/downl...c-4fe5-a579-30b0bd915706/MPSRPT_SETUPPerf.EXE

If you like, download and run this tool and email me the cab file:

adrynalyne@msn.com

It allows me to get a better idea of whats going on with your system.

 

Hmmm, all of the services seem to be set
properly in regards to logging on, they
are all enabled for profile1 and have
what I assume is the proper setting
for desktop interaction.

 

Adrynalyn,

Ok, I'll run the tool in a bit and mail you the
cab. I'm sorry you're sick, and I hope you
feel better....Nyquil sucks, but at least it
works, if you can swallow it.

Take it easy and thanks for the help,
RJS

 

Have a good coma dude, get some rest

 

Pretty sure my daughter gave this cold to me. With her being 11 months old, she shares everything she catches with Dad .

Here is the website for those tools, if you guys are interested. They are incredibly handy.

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...7C-7CA5-408F-88B7-F9C79B7306C0&displaylang=en

My drug-laden mind can't remember where the cab file gets saved atm. You might actually have to do a *.cab search for it on your drive

 

Ok, I recreated the CD from scratch then reinstalled
it (that's why it took me so long to post back).
Here's the whole story, and what not to EVER do.

Adrynalyne: I'm going to restate a few things so new
people reading this thread can maybe
gain from it if they're making a automated
XP. Oh, and I would have mailed that cab
but the tool hung: with and without MSINFO.
It hung when gathering networking info.

Alright, I ran the winnt.exe setup file (not the winnt32.exe)
and ran it with the /noreboot option.

This being accomplished, I ended up with the two
setup folders on the HD, renamed them properly, etc., etc. and had a ~340Mb install set instead of 440Mb.
Then, I extracted a bootsector from my CD, edited
the install location to point to XPV1, copied all the
setup start-up files to XPV1, and copied all the
setup files to i386. I put both of these folder in a
root directory called CDROOT and copied a couple of other required files to the CDROOT directory.

Finally, I edited the txtsetup.sif and created a
winnt.sif file. In the txtsetup.sif I simply edited
where the source files were located and where
to look for the cdtag files (I moved the cdtag
file from the root directory to a directory
called ROOT under i386 eg: /i386/root/).
Also, I edited the line sourcepath="\" to point
to where I put the i386 folder (also not in the root),
and I changed the ram requirements from 64 to 31
(I wanted to install it on my PIII 450 laptob that
only has 32mb of ram, which it installed and ran
nicely on once I stopped all the network services).

Afterwards, I gathered ME, 98, and 95b, and put them
in the CDROOT directory with automated msbatch files,
each one in their corresponding folder.


I like CDShell, so I used it to script a bootmenu for
the install [f1]=xp,[f2]=me, etc.

Also, I don't like the speed that windows/dos formats
a HD, so I downloaded FreeDOS' FDisk.exe and
Format.exe (the Fdisk.exe from FreeDOS has an
option to FDISK /CLEARALL to quickly clear the
drive with no option, which I like, and the Format.exe
runs about 50X faster than Format.com though it is
really buggy when formatting Fat32 under a Win98
command.com).

Ok, now, for the memory manager I kept Himem.sys
and I used shsucdx and cdrcache for my CD-Rom
handling. I used device.com to load IBMIDECD.SYS
as the driver and set ATAPICD1 as the device name.
I then used cdrcache to create an 8mb cache buffer for the ATAPICD1 device which created a CDROM1 device.
Finally, I used shsucdx to actually grab the CDROM1
device and assign a drive letter to it. So, each time
I queried the CD it followed the path:
shsucdx -> cdrcache -> ibmidecd.sys.

Lastly, I created a 2Mb ram drive with xmsdsk using
the xmsdsk %ramdrv% 2048 /y /t options to load it
onto the top of the memory and not ask me if i really
wanted to load it.

An important note to add to this is that all the files
mentioned in the bootup process here were in a
floppy image that was loaded from cdshell using the
memdisk command.

All this said, do note that the disk image wasn't
loaded when I launched xp (through a chain command
to chain the loader.bin with windowsxp.dat).

But, what I'm doing here is giving the layout of
the cd and noting which files I edited.

So, what we ended up with is this:
ROOT-
|- XPV1 (Xp Setup start files)
|- OS
|-- i386
|-- ROOT
|-- cdtag files, and the support folder.
|-- 98
|-- 95B
|-- ME
|-- DISKS (floppy images for the 9x installs and
the WindowsXP.dat to chain for XP)
In txtsetup.sif, i changed the sourcepath to
OS/i386/ and the catalog paths to OS/i386/ROOT
and in WindowsXP.dat (the bootsector), i changed the
root directory to XPV1 for the base setup files.

Now, the only things I can think of that caused the
problem would be:
1) XP, asside from the 64mb limit in txtsetup.sif, has
built in monitors of minimum ram settings and
won't install all of the services if the limit in
txtsetup.inf is too low.
2) CDShell's loader.bin and XP's bootsector don't
like each other/have a conflict.
3) With CDShell loaded during a fully automated
install of XP there is not enough conventional
memory and XP chokes during parts of the
install but doesn't report it because it is
automated.
4) Even though the sourpath is set in txtsetup.inf,
XP setup has a few hardcoded base path's
that always point to root/i386 regardles of
what is in txtsetup.inf. Thus, changing the
i386 folder location caused it to not find
some files even though the path in txtsetup.inf
pointed to the proper path.
5) It should have worked right and an error was
made during the ISO creation process (some
hickup frmo mkisofs).
6) The txtsetup.sif file is not the only place where
the sourcepath is defined (EG: the gui setup
file also has a definition for the path, and
during the gui part of the setup it was
reading files from the wrong directory).
7) any other ideas?


I recreated the CD (using the exact files off of the
non-working CD), but changed the paths back to their
normal paths: EG: /i386, /XPV1 (for startup files), and
just put the cdtagfiles and the bootsector in the root
of the cd and added a support folder for the setupmgr
and other files. Also, I changed the sourcepath and
cdtag path's back to "/". When i burned this CD, it worked
with no problems.

After checking a few times and making sure that I had
set the path names properly in the txtsetup.sif file,
I can only wonder why moving the folders didn't
work.

Anyways, I believe that the problem was the sourpath
and not CDShell, but I'm not going to keep creating
ISO's to find out. Put simply, don't try to move XP's
folder from the cd root unless you want to spend some
time looking through files and you have a good VM (like
VirtualPC).

Thanks again to Adrynalyne and alanc for your
suggestions and help.

Thanks all,
RJS

PS: If anyone has any ideas about what else
could have went wrong, let me know.

PPS: This is not meant to be a tutorial on AIO
install disks, so don't post asking for
help following the crude outline above.