Cheap mATX case?

Yeah I know what you're saying.
It's not quite as simple as how good a game looks though, it's dependant on things like how much is going on on screen, how much draw distance there is.
A good example is GTA4, it's a PC killer as far as specs go, but look at it, it doesn't look THAT fantastic compared to something like Mass Effect 2, but requires a beast of a PC to run it high spec.

I don't know what to tell you Bio, you need a GFX card period, we already knew this. The rest of your system is good, an extra stick of RAM at some point will help a little but GFX first.
I feel for you man I really do, I'd happily send you my X1950 but I know 100% it will fail in the case you have because it's heat damaged so needs super cooling to run below 90C.
I gave it to a friend who has pretty much the same setup as you and it lasted 8 minutes before it shut down from over heating. If I think of some way to get you a GFX boost , you'll be the first to know.

I am going to look into this wow thing though, see how it runs on my system because from what those guys were saying it requires a lot more than the Devs say it does.

Edit: The only thing I can suggest you do for now is to play with the settings, turn some things up and some things down and fiddle until you find a happy medium. Things like Draw Distance and Anti-Aliasing, Anisotropic Filtering are all heavy heavy on graphics for how much you benefit from them.
Shadows on low will help and all you're missing is shadows, things like that. Fiddle until you at least enjoy playing it.
Also running something like Game Booster will help, try anything and everything to get the maximum out of your GFX, I don't know if you have CCC software with tat GFX but you could try the overclock software in it, be aware you will be stressing it so keep an eye on temps if you choose to do that.

 

I really don't like wow that much anyway, I notice that a lot of games; the requirements are way off. I think I should be able to keep my self busy with s.u.n and a.v.a for a while until I'm able to get a card, all in good time i guess. But as i said before, least this setup runs better than a p4 and i can actually do more than just internet browsing now.

 

Hey anyone know of any decent SATA (Win 7 compatible) CD Burner / DVD Burner / Re writable, I can get in the price range of 26 dollars?? That's all i have to spend on one right now, I looked at some on new egg but after reading the cons for most of them not only was i disappointed but pretty frustrated at this point.

 

Actualy I guess it doesn't matter about the CD-R / RW part, as long as it has a CD rom / DVD rom / DVD-R / DVD-RW.. I can always use the gf's laptop for CD-R.

 

anyone? lol

 

This Lite-On is a good deal. I've used Lite-On DVD-RW drives in a number of builds and found they have been very reliable units. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106289

Sam

 

Looks good to me, has WAY better reviews than the one's i looked at, I went ahead and got it. Thanks

 

So i thought id humor my self and try playing a game on this rig that's for PS3, 360 and PC, Shockingly it does really well, 15 - 18 FPS MED settings.

http://www.prototypegame.com/us/index.html#footer

I also ran Resident evil 5 benchmark and i got about the same.

Prototype is more than playable for the most part, I only have problems when i get in a huge boss fight, FPS drop.. Pretty cool game though..

More amused every day to the fact that i can play games like this getting more FPS than WoW, Prototype is only a year old so they can't give me that crap saying it's because it's an old game lol..

 

Glad you getting some gaming in

Prototype is a great game, just run around smashing the crap out of everything lol
I wondered about Resi 5, thats quite impressive. Good game too.

I knew the system was good enough to play this stuff minus the GFX but obviously that onboard GFX is pretty good considering.

You just passed over the welcome mat of PC gaming lol, now onto the lounge then to the VIP area :-D

 

Heck yeah! smashing is good, lol. Bioshock 2 is doing well for me as well. It's kinda boring, maybe it gets better more into the game, who knows. It is good to see that this thing is handling these games decently on low to med settings.

 

Bioshock games are kind of like that, I havn't tried the second one yet but I've seen it played.
They have great atmosphere and some cool stuff, but they tend to get very repetetive very quickly. Much like Assassin's Creed, fantastic game for the first 2 hours.

 

Yeah, I'm sure it'll get more interesting as i get higher in level.

 

My boy says it's better than the first, I'll try it sometime, I'm kind of drawn into Battlestations Pacific at the moment, blowing boats and planes up with........boats and planes lol
Actually I thought it was going to be boring but turns out it's pretty intense, got it free with my video card :-D

 

I've been playing the demo of Battlestations Pacific, it is fun. What's odd is if I want to download the full game from GameStop, it's $50. But if I go to a GameStop retail store and buy a hard copy it's only $20. As I go by about 5 of them on the way to/from work I think I'll save the $30.

Sam

 

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/1278/hmme.jpg

is this good or bad??

Not sure how the numbers work.

 

lol Hey Bio.

Good or bad? well your CPU is higher than mine, my ram is higher because I have a gb more than you and my GFX is higher for obvious reasons.

It's not bad, not fantastic but this simply brings us right back to the start of your thread......you need a graphics card.

The only numbers I beat you on there are graphics really, the ram can be sorted with $30.

And the old test is the best, if it runs ok, then it's ok

Still need graphics to be doing what you want to do though

 

Yeah you're right, i can see your graphics and gaming numbers are higher because you have a good card, and your ram is higher because you have more ram. That pretty much tells me what I wanted to know. I might just go ahead and get more ram first because it's cheaper.

 

Yep, grab yourself a GB of ram, will give you a bit of a boost and then hopefully fairly soon (for your sake) you can throw some heavy GFX in, on the up side, the longer you wait, the cheaper the older high end cards get.

 

I've got a HD5850 which is why my graphics scores are high. I got a 5.9 with my old 640Gb SATA II HD, stayed the same when I upgraded to the 1Tb. Must be the max the SATA interface on this mobo will do.

Sam

 

how much did that card cost, 2 - 3 hundred dollars? lol.

 

The HDD section is based on transfer rate, not storage capacity

@Bio... Yes the 5850 is around $300 at the moment.

 

nedlamar- yeah I've seen some WEI scores where it's over 7, but that's with a solid state hard drive.

bio- I paid $300 for my Sapphire 100282SR HD5850 a couple months ago. Currently selling at $330 at Newegg (out of stock tho'). Great card, should hold me for a good couple years.

Sam

 

Are most games like ME2 and bio shock, dead space, 32bit games?

 

@Scajjr... Yeah solid State drives so I've recently found out are immensly faster than HDD's, also need a mortgage to buy one lol
On a HDD it largely comes down to the RPM, most standard in the past few years are 7200rpm, before that and still available are 5400rpm. There are also gaming HDD's that are 10,000 and 15,000rpm, but much more expensive.
I compared Halo's "Older" SSD to my 7200rpm HDD and his lowest speed was 4 times that of my highest...... I want one!! :-D

@Bio... If you mean, will they work on 32 bit, yes, almost all games will work on 32 or 64bit operating systems.

 

Most games are still 32-bit, sometimes you may find one that includes a 64-bit version too, but still rare.

Sam

 

Oh thats a good point actually, any game I've installed on 64bit goes into x86. Mind you, I havn't had 64bit OS for 3 years lol
But they will still work normally

 

Was just looking on Newegg. 64Gb SSDs run about $150, 80Gb about $220. Saw a 256Gb for just under $700. Have been toying with getting a 40 or 64Gb just to put Win 7 on and run apps off the 640gb SATA.

Sam

 

Yeah I've been toying too, even though I don't have ANY money right now lol, but even in a month or so when I get working again, I'm not sure I can warrant spending that much money on a 40 or 60GB hard drive.
If I am going to get one I want it big enough to hold my OS, my software AND my games (which I currently have installed on a storage HDD) and use HDD's for my files.
So it would have to be minumum 160GB.......I'm hoping they drop a bit in price over the summer :-D

 

No one has any money, i just need a job. lol. I think that's the only way I'm gonna get a good card. Damn it all for screwing up my work record when i was younger..

 

I'm very thankful wife and I have decent state/county jobs which (unfortunately) are safer in tough times in our programs (WomensInfantsChildren for her, USDA Surplus Food Program for me). But I was out of work 3 years ago, got my CDL truck license and got this job just before the economy tanked. Met wifey 2 months later, 3rd anniversary in July.

Guess I shouldn't mention the 42" plasma I just boughtrolleyes.

Sam

 

Nice! lol.

 

I was doing ok, I've been off work since Dec 18th 09 (also not had a penny from anywhere) due to an injury at work, just been denied insurance payout and have to fight it through court over the next year. IF/when I win I should get a nice 9-12K payout (lost earnings).......guess what some of that will be spent on :-D

@Scajjr..... Dude, more power to you, you earn your money, you have no reason to feel bad. I envy you but in a good way, I like to see people doing well

Wait......did you say 42" plas......son of a....

 

Yeah 42" of Win 7 desktop looked awesome firing up the HTPC the first time. It's a Samsung PN42C450, was only $539 at Sears. Only 720p but you'd never know it.

Wife and I are seeing a lot more middle class/income folks coming on to the programs. The Commodity Supplemental Food Program I work for normally had more seniors (have to be 62, meet income guidelines) but more families with young kids (families with kids up to age 6, meeting income guidelines are eligible) are getting the surplus food rather than WIC. The food package is only about $40 worth of mostly non-perishables (cereal, canned veggies, canned fruit, some canned meat, juices, pasta/rice, evap milk, powdered milk, gov't cheese) but it helps.

Sam

 

I bet it was pretty awesome even for 720p, Yeah the gf gettin ready to have our fist kid in three months, we got a couple food programs goin and her medical is covered, I'm S O L as for medical coverage or anything else, I'm bout as poor as poor gets, I haven't been to a doctor in over 5 years.

Yeah, Free clinics exist but they REALLY suck.

 

I'm 56, my youngest (4 daughters) just turned 31. Hope things turn around for you soon. Read an article about UPS needing to hire 25,000 new drivers over the next few years to replace retiring baby boomer generation drivers. Average salary is $74,000. They are supposed to be opening a 2nd high tech training compound near Chicago soon. Long days but great pay and bennies.

Back to the original topic (kinda) just ordered a cheap setup to upgrade my HTPC (Biostar MCP6PB-M2+ mobo, Sempron X2 2200 w/HS&fan Newegg combo $65 + 2Gb DDR2-800 $54) and am looking for a decent HTPC case. Any suggestions? My old setup is in a mid-tower case but need a smaller desktop (5-6" high)-like case to fit in the cabinet we're getting

Sam

 

What would it take to get my graphics to a 6.5/7.0 or so? How much money? Lol.

 

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! You only have 720, I have 1080P
Mine is only 24" though
:-D

Actually I very nearly went for a 32" because it was on sale but I don't know if I want that size to be honest.

@Bio.... Dude, you're looking at it wrong, forget your scores on Windows, you pass, any upgrade will simply make the numbers go up. You need a GFX card and you're looking to get as much as you can for your money.
$300ish will get you somewhere level with me which I think will satisfy you, since getting my card I have run every game I've tried at max settings (and I say max meaning MAX, not everything on high but no AA or filtering)
Only Crysis has given me FPS under 25 and a couple of others lag a little when it gets really heavy, games like Total War (new ones) will stress your CPU in major scale naval battles.

I can't remember what PSU you got but remember that is a factor in upgrading GFX.

$200ish will get you a good card that will impress you but I'm thinking you WANT high end, so $300+.
Also looking at the new range of cards isn't always the best way to go, you could get more bang for your buck going with the older range like I did, you need about $4-500 to match my $300 card in the 5000 series ATI's and my card is future proofed enough for a couple of years.
I also remember you getting a Micro ATX case, this may also be a factor, these GFX cards we speak of are BIG, mine is 11" long and nearly 5" wide and 2" thick. (roughly)

An HD 4870 will do what you want, the 4890 will last you longer and give you a bit more poke, to match them in the 5000 series will cost you more.

Example:

http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102883

The 5870 @$439CAD, nice card, almost identical specs as my 4890 which I paid $300 for 2months ago.

The 5870 has twice the stream processors and slightly lower nm making it a little faster GPU, but my 4890 has 2gb of GRAM as opposed to 1gb, so the little extra speed on the GPU you get from the 5870 is leveled or possibly outweighed by the extra RAM on the 4890 meaning it certainly isn;t worth an extra $150 IMO.

Trouble is, finding older cards gets trickyer as time goes on.

Once again, you need to get yourself a budget and we'll go hunting to spend your money again :-D

 

OK here's a sampling:

1Gb, 256-bit GDDR3 around $130 max you've got a 9800GT, a GTS250 and a HD4850.

1Gb, 128-bit GDDR5 you can get a HD5770 for $160

1Gb, 256-bit GDDR5 you've got a HD5830 at $250.

1Gb, 256-bit GDDR5 at around $330 you've got the HD5850.

Sam

 

My computer monitor is a 1080p 25" LCD and has a 2nd HDMI input so I could always add a Comcast HD box to it.

Have had a couple friends with 1080p LCD TVs come over and they can't believe mine's only 720p. And with 600Hz there is no motion blur at all.

Been looking at an Antec Fusion Remote HTPC case. $140 at Newegg. Supposed to have excellent cooling/air flow and will handle full sized cards.

Sam

 

It'll take me a good while to come up with money for a card, just wanted to know what id be facing to get a higher score. I just ordered another 2gb of ram, A more affordable upgrade for now, exact same stick i already have, I might go 64 bit. I'll probably end up getting a more suited case before a card as well, I don't wanna risk any heat issues with such pricey hardware. Btw whats the diff between 720p and 1080 and Just HD ready?? I don't get that about monitors that don't say 720p/1080p, but just HD ready.

 

@Scajjr... I hate you lol , just out of curiosity, what made you go for LCD over plasma?

@Bio... Yeah thats cool man, you seem to have a thirst for knowledge which is a good thing when wanting to do this stuff, knowing what you are looking at is a big advantage.
As I've said before, prices on pc parts drops so rappidly too, the longer you wait the more you will get for your money, unless you wait so long it's outdated lol, but I don't think you're in too much danger of that.
As for HD Ready, as far as I know "HD Ready" doesn't mean "HD" as such, it was something they were allowed to stamp TV's with that could pick up an HD signal, even if you see something like "HD Ready 1080P" probably means it is not "HD 1080p", I think it kind of works along similar lines as "False/virtual surround sound"
The price of monitors now though I would'nt worry, $200 will get you a good 1080p 24" monitor..... it did me :-D

 

I chose plasma over LCD actually. Part of the decision was most screen size for my budget. Wanted to spend about $550. In that price range was an Insignia 37" LCD at Best Buy and two 42" plasmas: Samsung and Panasonic. All 3 were $539 (at Amazon.com, Best Buy and Sears).

Another factor is the fact my wife and I both have eyes sensitive to light. And LCDs are bright( my PC monitor is a 25" LCD and I have the brightness set at 14 and the whites still are bright). So to me a plasma viewed in a darker room would be better for us. We don't have a BluRay player (yet) so 720p I figured would be fine (TV is about 7 feet from where we sit).

Looked at all 3 at Best Buy, liked the overall picture quality of the Samsung. Could just be my eyes but it seems to have a very sharp, crisp picture, excellent blacks. Read a lot of reviews online which said the Samsung had a great picture and the fact it is a new model with lower power consumption and excellent burn-in protection schemes. Ended up getting it at Sears cause Best Buy was out of stock.

Sam

 

HD Ready means it can show HD (720p or 1080p depending on model) but has no HD tuner (or any tuner actually).

A 1080p TV can upconvert a 720p signal (most HD TV channels are 720p right now). A 720p TV has to down-convert a 1080p signal and some can do it w/o you noticing any real difference, some cheapies don't do it well. BluRay discs are 1080p BTW.

I have no idea which of my Comcast HD channels (we have about 60) are 720p or 1080p. Haven't noticed much difference between them so either they're in 720p or my Samsung has a good upconverter.

Waiting on UPS for my mobo/cpu/mem/vid to arrive.

Sam

 

Got the new stuff up and running, nice little setup to update my HTPC. Put the 8400GS vid card (was in wife's until I put my old 9800GTX+ in hers) in it. Mobo can take a lot of the AM3 CPUs so it should hold me for a while.

Ordered the Antec Fusion Remote case, should be here Fri. Read one review where the guy said it caught on fire (wires to LCD display), I'd venture a guess he didn't connect it right:confused

Sam

 

An excellent card!

I just got one, and i haven't looked back yet! Plays everything you need it to, IMO anything more than this card is just overkill, unless you want 100+ FPS on 1080p res with eyefinity, you will be fine with the 5830! :-D

 

I love my 5850. It was $299 when I got it, now they all seem to be up in the $330 range. ATI drivers can be a bit odd though. A recent set dropped the idle/2D core and mem speeds too low, causing green pixels to randomly show up. Installed a new beta set last nite (with higher idle/2D core and mem speeds) and pixels are gone.
I had downloaded an ATI BIOS editor to try to up them myself but these drivers came out before I could monkey around with it.

Now if Verizon would get the Android 2.1 update going for my HTC Eris all would be good.

Sam

 

lol you're just saying that because you can't afford an HD5970

Just curious though, given my experiences with my card and the specs between it and your 5830, when you say it plays everything, thats a pretty wide statement and are you talking about optimal settings or high settings?

Don't get me wrong, not ragging on your card, just curious because if you are ploughing through games on max settings with AA and everything up and getting 40? 60? FPS then there is a problem with my system.
Although I still think my CPU is bottlenecking my GFX.

Have you tried the ultimate game test?.....Crysis, the first one, still the standard 4 years on lol, I can't get over 30FPS maxed out (unless I stare at the sky, I get 145FPS then :-D ) and get drops down to 16FPS when it gets busy.
No other game drops below 25-30FPS at any point, many run at a solid50-60FPS, with the exception of Empire Total War naval battles which simply comes down to not having enough on the CPU, but the naval battles in that game are heavy.

 

@Ned

All results using Fraps.

It plays MW2 on 4xAA 1680x1050 all settings at "Extra" at ~80FPS.

Plays Order of war - same res, all settings at high and 4xAA (i think) at ~65FPS

Plays CoD WaW same res, 4xAA All stuff at Extra at ~80 FPS

Arkham aslyum same res, 4xAA All settings at the max, Max FPS 113 AVG 94

I haven't got Crysis, so i havnt included that one.

Maybe, rolleyes

 

I cringed when I spent the $300 for the 5850, I just can't imagine laying down $700 for a vid card.

Sam

 

@Burrell.. Very nice, to be honest I'm quite surprised at that in some ways, especially with the temps you have.
I should reinstall MW2 and see what it runs at, I can't remember what I was getting but I do remember using FRAPS to record my Assault course (can't remember the name of it lol) and pushed everything to max and got around 20FPS while recording, but don't remember what I got while not recording lol

What CPU and RAM you have?
If I remember right you have an X2?

@Scajjr... No kidding, but if I could afford it I would in a heartbeat :-D
2 of 'em :-D ...........and a fire extinguisher.