Is it just me...

... or are Vista users asking for trouble?

I'm just seeing so many people disable UAC, or doing things like this:

No offense to the OP, but this seems like opening big holes in your security to me... you want EVERYTHING to be able to use CMD.EXE as an administrator????

I'm not missing something, am I? Sure UAC is annoying, but it's there for a reason?

 

Vista sucks.

 

Its up on the chopping block for ranting...already hit Linux and Apple

 

"I could disable it, but then I would get no warnings at all!"

"You are coming to a sad realization. Allow or deny?"

*sigh* "Allow."

 

here's the reason why I disabled UAC. I do not want the OS to ask for my permission why I initiate a command. I know it cannot differentiate between me telling it to open program x and program x starting on it's own, but I should be responsible enough to know whether or not I installed program x or I picked it up somewhere. Maybe UAC was not made for me, as I don't visit those types of websites (yeah, i know i could pick something up anywhere). But i can't stand all the authorization. Linux has it too and I hate it. I'm sticking with XP until I can get a Vista Ultimate license (sorry, no Mac's or Linux here).

 

Alternative OSes aren't for everyone.

Linux issues with the authorization crap are easily bypassed with sudo.

Remember, not running as root isn't meant to be friendly, its meant to be safer. I said it a long time ago, and I'll say it again.

MS cannot make a user friendly, and secure OS. THe more secure you get, the less friendly. You make one group happy, while pissing off the other.

I for one do not envy MS at that point. As for Linux, its OSS. Don't like it, don't use it. OS X--well, Apple is in a similar boat as MS.

 

This is where they lose me with user controls. Your average home user might not understand why they are even being asked to allow or deny. Only two things can happen at this point:

1. "Well, I was just trying to run my media player, what's the harm, (Clicks Allow)

2. "Why wont this %&$#@ing thing let me run my media player. Vista Sucks!! (Tells all his friends)

 

I tried a beta version but did not feel good about it so i will wait to see the comments that come up on this forum before i buy a full version

 

I've not yet tried Vista . . . and don't intend to unless I should build a new system (just makes sense to put Vista on a new PC at the outset). I'll continue to use XP Pro because it works very well for me and what I use a PC for, unless my needs change and I must use Vista. When MS stops supporting XP I'll consider it outdated and upgrade to Vista at that point. Also, maybe by that time any bugs will have been dealt with . . .

I do have a question, though . . . on these Vista security pop-ups, isn't there a check-box for "Remember this answer" or something along that line that you can use to "weed" out some of them (like Zone Alarms pop-ups, for example)? Or is this Vista security feature a whole new kind of animal?

Just curious

 

I would guess that you dont need these warnings Mada! Some do, Some dont

In your own words Adrynalyne....no one is forcing your hand!

Im surprised by this comment Halo! not the Halo that i know!

well, what can i say.....give it a chance, yes its new, yes its different, yes it may take us out of our XP comfort zone....but you guy's will all see that eventually, it is truely superior...

Dont care what you say.....and you call yourselves geeks!

Geeesh!

Poem from the crawler ....Linux is crap, XP is old hat

Look beyond the trees dudes

Regards..

 

Alright... simmer down....

I was just quoting a Mac commercial on the subject...

 

Yep....agreed, but why all the hype sorrounded at vista's security?

Sure, its first class (or pain in the arse) as far as an OS goes, but it is by no means the best part of vista's greatest features!

Dont like UAC?.....easy! disable it at the security centre and hell, even configure the way that the security centre warns you if need be.
Same goes for defender!

Most of us know that we should not install unwanted software and at very least, we should have our firewalls configured to deny access to anything that is unauthorized......We really dont need the OS to ask this of us, but as i said before, perhaps some do!

As its so easily gotten rid of, i dont understand the attention it receives, as that should be more positively focused in vista's better area's!!

Regards...

 

That was a tongue in cheek comment. You don't want to debate with me on this, trust me.
I understand you haven't been here long enough to know me, Halo doesn't take me serious for a reason.

 

Thanks, Halo. It occurs to me that this is true for all such security pop-ups. What is special about Vista's security in this respect? There has to be more to it then the absence of a Remember setting checkbox. Please bear with me - I am just thinking out loud and find myself intrigued by the topic (and slightly intoxicated) . . . . . . I have to confess I am increasingly intrigued by the various and opposed opinions I see about Vista . . .(I recall like discussions about XP). I may have to give it a go, just to see for myself!

Well said, Sir. . .I have run into the same mindset with firewalls. Whenever I "de-crap" a friends PC, I always install a firewall (and anti-virus, if they don't have it . . . and sadly I have received PC's that, in this day and age, don't have any AV protection . . . rolleyes ) . I always provide verbal and written information (usually in the form of a Read Me file) about what the firewall is for, and what will happen as they go about their business online. Too often these sad souls manage to learn just enough about firewalls (and or AV) to shut it/them down . . . because it was just too much of a bother; then they want to complain their PC is messed up again . . . I guess having their PC crash and wanting to cart it over (yet again) to my house is less of a bother? In the end . . . ANY security measure an O.S. takes is dependant on the end-user . . .

Whatcha gonna do? rolleyes

 

Not sure if this answers your question Natakel, but you do not run as root in Vista. That, and it wants your permission for every little thing, including things like configuration in the control panel. Coming from Linux, this is familiar territory, but for a Windows user, this isn't something familiar.

Thats one of the biggest (and needed) security features of Vista, is not running as root except when given permission.

 

Thanks, Adrynalyne and Halo . . . I'll do a bit of research on it. The root info does clear a bit of it up for me . . .

Just wondering . . . I get that way when tired and slightly intoxicated . . .

 

I commend Microsoft for this effort in Vista. In my opinion it took a great deal of intestinal fortitude to come to terms with a fundamental error in their implementation of their previous operating systems. From the earliest days, the Microsoft brain trust had to cope with slow hard drives, tiny amounts of ram memory and a kludged microprocessor family in their vain attempt to compete with much faster DOS-only applications on equivalent platforms. I remember those days very well. Under Microsoft DOS, Digital Research DOS and many, many other disk operating systems, there was no security but the DOS had its own directory and the applications were installed in their own separate directories. It was generaly construed as heresy and blasphemy to install any other application in the DOS directory and you'd sneer at any idiot who did. When you didn't need an application any more, you deleted the contents of it's directory and it was gone. There was no need for a registry database to keep track of the bits and pieces of a program. All of the program was in that directory, period. Operating system and applications should be kept separate. That was a fundamental concept, that was worth preserving.
However, the Windows OS layer on top of the DOS layer made Windows Applications slow. They looked pretty good ( for their day ) but it was awfully hard to give up "Word Perfect for DOS" for the much slower less powerful Microsoft Windows offering. So Microsoft came up with a solution. They let it be known throughout the land, that all Windows Applications Programmers should henceforth implement the new Microsoft Edict of Compliance: "Let all program components that need to be accessed multiple times be installed in the Windows System Directory." Hallelujah. That actually worked. Windows Applications now worked so much faster, although, deleting any unwanted applications left behind a residue of orphaned DLLs and drivers.
Remember, there was still NO security on these machines, so filling the System directory with application bits and pieces made no difference at all. By the time Microsoft was instructed by the business community to develop security for it's OS, many generations of young programmers had been taught throughout the land. They learned two equally important rules. 1: When you allocate 256 bytes of memory, be sure to de-allocate 256 bytes of memory. Otherwise, you'll end up working at Microsoft's Application Division. 2: If you do end up at Microsoft's Application Programming Farm, make sure all multi-use DLL's and drivers are installed in the System directory. But by then the Windows GUI had merged with Windows NT OS,(NT 4) and suddenly you needed Administrator priviledges. With the advent of Security, all applications, written to be Microsoft Edict Compliant would need elevated priviledge to even be able to install programs into the System directory. So people would just leave their machines in the Admin account to retain that "no-security" feel of Windows 98. This way they were able to install viruses and malware without any of those annoying message boxes.
With the new Vista OS, Microsoft is making a genuine attempt to undo the old Edict of Compliance and replace it with a corrected edict. There are very, very BIG egos involved here, so this change of policy took a massive amount of guts. Anyone who wrote code for Microsoft Windows knows it was their fault that the System directory got bloated and that security was compromised with every program install. But that's the way they wanted it, so everyone played along. But these days, let's face it - hard drives are fast, memory is plentiful and the need to stuff the System directory with application DLLs and drivers, isn't there any more. So Microsoft has decided "Let's not do that anymore.". And that, my friends is good for everyone. So be patient with the UAC for a while. Eventually all software code writers and installation writers will adapt to this much more sensible arrangement. You never know, maybe we'll end up with an OS directory completely separate from the Applications. At least with Vista, that's the path that Microsoft has announced they're taking. I think I'll take that path too!

 

No one person wrote Windows, so only Microsoft as a company can take the blame.

 

I like Vista, recently bought a new laptop and at the time was hoping to get it before vista came installed(was about a week late). Bought it and the first thing I intended to do was reformat and install 64bit linux. Still haven't done it and don't think I will, which will make this the first rig in quite a while I haven't made dual boot or Linux only. Don't know why but for some reason I really like vista

 

Yep, the story of Bill Gates and his company, Microsoft, comes from many sources over the last thirty years or so.

It's somewhat analogous to owning cars. We can service and modify for a time, maybe real long time. But sooner or later, we will need to upgrade to a new model. Still basically a car, but the changes may be anything from moderate to dramatic. Usually much more positive than negative changes.

Same story with O.S.'s. I still own a version of the now defunct O.S.2, which he (Gates) was supposedly developing for I.B.M., until he bought it out, what was then D.R.DOS (Digital Research) off the guy's wife for $50k, I.I.R.C. Windows GUI was borrowed from Xerox Parc system (Pre-Apple days), etc. The rest is history, as they say.

 

Ya know I think the only real "issues" that I have with this whole vista thing is the hype. Just let it be. If you like it... great. If you don't... STFU! Dont sit and whine about it please... If I wanted whining I have 3 daughters and soon to have a 4th. ( apparently I worked around nukes and I dont remember ) Well the hype and this whole Areo crap..... Yes yes we all know Mac did it first... and MS ripped off the idea and improved it a little. On the other hand BERYL did it 10xs better and for free just because they could. Y'all have fun with this topic. Because in the end it all comes down to personal preferences and if somebody doesn't want to be swayed then you have a better chance of seeing jesus in a sidecar.

 

Vista sucks.

 

This is such a well researched article that I'm actually flabbergasted at the amount of work that you have put into it. I thank you for bringing this explosive issue to us who visit Major Geeks for factual information. Thanks for looking out for the little guy. I wish I had a dollar every time I see you say that.:rasberry

 

Why, thank you

I need something new to bash

 

Yeeh-Haar!!.

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g309/Zobor/2007_New/Vista_Sux.gif


"We goin' to a 'tar Party', Rastus!.."

 

AWESOME!

I am so stealing that for my blog!

 

Hehe, I'll be waiting for your acidic rant/rave. You do it well.

 

I've been busy working on a chem lab report. Soon. Soon.

 

U R welcome. I thought you'd like that one, (Hmmm...He even look a bit like you). I read your blog, and I'd have to agree with pretty much all you said. Exorbitant price has always been Apple's main handicap. After thirty years, one would have hoped they would learn. You do, indeed rant well.:cool

...So when do we get to tar and feather an Apple Powerbook and ignominiously drag it down the street?
(Or maybe you might want to wait, and save it for the warranty dude! )

 

oooohhh...OK you wont get me to bite!

Yes you are right Adrynalyne, i have only been here for 5 minutes compared to your vast and expansive input into this fantastic web site that we call Majorgeeks!
Let it be known that i have the upmost respect for your in depth knowledge and many, many contributions that you have always freely offered to others, and i know that i could not possibly compete with this without a fair amount of research and study on my behalf.....If that!


I now prepare for, and look forward too, the debate ahead!

Cheers dude!!

@prometheos, Halo and lanfear...... wise words!


Regards..


oooh, nearly forgot.......Linux is for lobsters! (only good as an anchor)

 

I just LOL'ed in real life!


HAHAHAH

 

--and with that, I've posted on my blog my sentiments with Vista. Seems only fair.

Nitecrawler, its all good. I forget that not everyone realizes my dry sense of humor

 

I don't have insurance

 

This post deserves sticky status

 

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