Torrents

Is using torrent clients to share filess as legally dangerous as conventional methods to share? I know Hollywood and the music industry aren't really doing much with torrents. The music industry is focusing on networks like the ones used by Bearshare/Kazaa/etc. and not random file-sharing methods like bittorrent. The movie industry just signed a deal with Bittorrent and I'm not sure if that means they won't sue or if it means they're gonna have future fee-based stuff.

 

Illegal is illegal. Torrents are just as easy to track as anything else.

 

I didn't say it wasn't. I'm just asking whether it's as dangerous legally as other means. i hear it's more focused on networks like the gnutella one. and if there's a limit to how much one can download in a given amount of time before raising flags.

I personally only use my torrent client once, twice a month max but I'm just wondering.

 

Ok...read the second part then.

 

yes it is.

 

I use torrents to download *nix distros as I can't afford an ftp account. The program in of itself is not illegal, just what you do with it.

 

You got lucky


There are some hefty fines out there.

 

Hey thanks, every time someone steals software I get to pay more for purchasing it legally.

 

Ive never been fined, but I really don't pirate much, just a few songs. cracked apps suck, it seems like they never run stable from my experiences, best to just buy it.I wuld really like to have ps though, are there any good free/cheap alternatives? paint.net sucks, it is all I've got.

 

And that's suppose to justify stealing because you only do it occasionally? Gee, where have I heard that before...oh yeah....shoplifters, car thieves, etc....

Think about this...if you think it would take you a long time to save up for a program that you don't really need in the first place cuz face it, you won't die without it right? So, think about how long it would take you to save up for the fines you'll have to pay when you get caught and the criminal record that will follow you the rest of your life. hmmmmmm

 

First of all please note that I am NOT trying to turn this into a flamefest. This is my view as both a parent and a one time child (quite a while back I admit but still I was ONCE a child - no comment from Kodo please).

I take offense at anyone trying to justify their crimes in the manner in which you have done here. There are many different jobs that you, as a young adult, could do if you just became a little bit motivated. Now as far as what your parents think, I whole-heartedly agree with them and so will you some day. After you take into consideration the time and money invested in you to bring you to the age you are now, you do owe them for quite a bit. So yes, it is expected of you to do the chores that are given to you by your parents. Not only does it help your parents out in their busy lives but it also should teach you a good work ethic and some responsibility. However, since you are not seeming to understand the basic precept of consideration for your parents maybe you will just have to learn about it the hard way. In the gray bar hotel after you get caught committing some real crimes because you just can't afford to get that neat pair of shoes any other way.

Now I'm stepping off of my soapbox for the evening. I promise to be good for at least the next 10 minutes or so.

Jack

 

Too bad, it's still stealing.

Ever heard of saving, or a part-time job (not to mention freeware that's available).


If you can't afford it, then the option is to save, or go without. That's life.


People that steal not only make software more expensive, but then we have to put up with copy protection and are forced to jump through hoops, just because someone is too cheap or lacking in morals.


I'm no angel, but I've never tried to justify it either.

 

What exactly do you mean by "I got caught"? Who confronted you on it, your ISP? How were you confronted, a letter or a phone call? Were you given a warning or what?

Not trying to encourage or even indulge anyone in what is a stupid thread anyway, I'm just curious what "getting caught" actually consists of.

So it's okay to do it and not talk about it, but if you talk about it, you're cheap and lacking in morals?

-evil

 

Let's see... Stealing Macromedia 8 because you can't afford it differs from stealing a Ferrari because you can't afford it how? Stealing software is easier. Morally, ethically, legally, they're both just as bad. And I doubt you NEED Macromedia any more than you need that Ferrari. They're both neat toys that you can't afford.

Guess what? I can't afford a Ferrari either, so I drive a Nissan. Make do with what you can afford, and if you want something bad enough, go out and get a job to pay for it. That's the way the world works.

Helping around home is part of being a family. Your folks provide you everything you have, and no doubt work their butts of doing it. A little grunt work around the house is only your fair share.

The biggest problem with stealing software is that it rots your conscience and teaches you that crime is OK if you're poor. That's a lousy life lesson.

 

My 2 cents...

Some of the software may seem hugely over priced - especially when you're dealing with high level stuff... but if you honestly knew hwo many man hours went into making that sort of software what it is (and no, there is a bit more to writing code than knocking some code out to a compiler) then you'd realise that maybe it isn't ridiculously over priced.
As a Software Engineer myself I appreciate the cost of software being a reflection of the amount of work that goes into it. Most of the time at least.

 

First let me say I am not picking on you, just trying to get you to understand and maybe keep you from getting into serious trouble.

The statements you are making to try and justify breaking the law carry no weight. They really don't.

You don't have to be 16 to earn money. I speak from experience. I did 'odd jobs' on a regular basis starting at age 12 from cleaning houses & vacant apartments to raking yards and weeding flower beds to shoveling sidewalks and driveways during the winter. Cleaned up dog doo, did some baby sitting and tutored kids younger than me having difficulty with reading and spelling. There are things you can do to earn money but you have to have the ambition to actively seek it out and follow through on it.

Added to that...I also had 'chores' to do around the house growing up in addition to assisting with the care of my handicapped brother...I didn't get at allowance either. Money was tight for a long time as is the case for most people and bottom line, kids SHOULD have responsibilities around the house. I feel I'm a better person for it.

[sarcasm] Oh and hey...now that I'm all grown up, after working for many years I'm disabled and can't work anymore so I guess by your standards it would be ok for me to steal now because I can't afford the software I want? [/sarcasm] That just sounds wrong doesn't it? If it doesn't it should.

A good rule of thumb: Is it something you want or something you need? If you want it, it can wait...it's unimportant...if you need it you work toward getting it 'legally' and can not only enjoy it but take pride in the fact that you worked toward a goal and accomplished it....you will reap the benefits for a very long time.

 

Getting slightly back to the point here:

Torrents are LEGAL. It's the copyrighted material people share with it that isn't! They are a fantastic way for low budget content creators to publish big files (like videos...) to a huge audience without the cost in bandwidth that kills their budget.

Exactly the same goes for other technologies like the Gnutella network. Except they are now so saturated with illegal material that it's hardly worth it.

So: use torrents. They rock. Don't pirate software. That doesn't rock.

 

True.


Of course, if you ask the question if Torrents are dangerous, then they aren't the legal kind, making that a moot point

 

Well, any download could be potentially dangerous, it depends where you're getting them from really

I just don't like how the means to share copyright material gets demonized rather than the people sharing it. It's stupid. It's like saying that roads are bad because they cause accidents. But without them you couldn't get to work/school/parents/airport/train station/anywhere.

Asking if they're dangerous is making the automatic assumption that you want to download illegal material. Which really has nothing to do with torrents specifically - more about the methods law enforcement agencies choose to use.

On the legal side of things: company lawyers haven't really got the whole bit torrent thing - at the moment they're barking up the wrong tree. The trackers don't have any copyright data (apart from maybe names), nor do they give out copyright data. They simply provide the means to access copyright data. The people that they should be targeting is the seeders who give out copyright data - who aren't hard to track down (how about you use the information the trackers give out rather than trying to sue them?) - since they are the ones actually committing a felony, NOT the trackers. More to the point if you manage to get a tracker to remove the torrent, then that doesn't stop the torrent being posted on any number of other sites - you're not stopping the data from spreading!

It's like trying to sue a telephone directory because they have numbers for illegal services in them. Yes, you could argue that they should try to screen the numbers - but then you're not giving an accurate representation of the services available in the local area - whether they're illegal or not is irrelevant! They are a business - therefore they should be listed. If they operate illegally then that's the company's problem, not the phone book!

Wow. </rant>. That was good!

 

Well said (as usual) Goldy.

 

It's sad really, most people who illegally download Photoshop use it like MS Paint with antialiasing. It's a fantastic application with many, many, many uses (from retouching photos to illustration to dynamically processing photographs through a web interface (which is possible using JavaScript!), to recovering images from grainy film, to all kinds of forensics jobs....) - and it is so casually ripped off.

*hits hands off keyboard* STOP....... RANT....... before........critical..... word count......

 

Too bad, it still doesn't mean it's OK to then steal.

Just because someone is too young to hold a drivers licence doesn't give them the right to steal a car or driver unlicenced.


All you're doing is trying to justify something that is clearly not.

 

I've had enough of this "the world owes me a living" rubbish, I have better things to do, like actually earning a living.

 

I don't understand, why poeple think they need these high-end applications, and then illegally download them; becuase they can't afford them.

The amount of good powerful FREE software is plentiful, you just have to take the time to look for it. If you spent just as much time looking for free legal software as you spend looking for illegal downloads of commercial software; you would find powerful graphics applications like GIMP and Blender3D. Open Source applications like Nvu and Amaya for Web Design. There are good FREE programs out there you just have to take the time to find them.

90% of the software on my system is Open Source. I bought PS, 2 years ago and I still cringe every time I think about the $650 I spent to get the program. If PS is out of your price range then there is Paint Shop Pro for $99, and the GIMP which is FREE.

 

He has NO "need" for it. He wants a Ferrari, can't afford it, and is too young to drive the damn thing anyway. NEED is not a factor.

 

GT, as always you're hit the nail on the head. Needs and wants; I want a Rolls Royce when all I need is a Yugo.

 

About Torrents .... Is it useful and faster to send files with torrents than it is to e-mail them? With a certain file I have been working on .... Right now it contains about thirteen files within and to e-mail it, I have to attach each one which is starting to take much longer as things grow ... would using torrent to transfer the file to it's destination be faster?






In regards to Micromedia program ... firstly it's a large file to install on your computer ... a real space sucker ... secondly, you can force companies to lower the price when you start using free, or free online versions of products similar to the one that you want.

Here is a link to a site for free web design tool ... very handy and very useful. Navigation is a pain in the butt and it takes time to get use to moving around in there. It does save space on your hard drive and best part ... it's free and legal. http://www.allprofitallfree.com/online-tools.html

 

No I think if you are wanting an easy way to email that file to someone then archiving the files (winzip/tar) would be the way forwards.
Torrents are useful when you have very large files which many people want to try and download - it tends to use everyones bandwidth concurrently to distribute the file faster and more efficiently than dealing with each persons request like a http download is dealt with.

I can't remember if I forwarded this link or not but more information on Torrents can be found here:
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/bittorrent.htm

 

Entirely correct If you're distributing a file (or set of files) to a single person, a torrent would be way more complicated than you need. It'd be like setting up your own bar to give someone a beer - which you could just take from the fridge.

 

Congratz!

Personally I use notepad++

 

H'm, I use that one myself.

 

Notepad++ also has Ruby syntax hilighting, which is good for me since I'm learning Ruby now

For some reason I don't really like Java applications. They seems slow, ugly and clunky. That's just my opinion though.

 

I believe P2P technknowlegy has made more money for the music industry, and others. seems I red somwhere that the industries agree. Though p2p isn't illegal, getting some of the stuff is...ala copywrite. Though I will say that cracked programs isn't right, I also believe that it in the long run is better advertising for "whatever in question". Companies are just starting to use this to their advantage.
There is an up to a down and vise versa.
Also leave the kid alone...A parent that doesnt give an allowance is very sad. Allowances makes for a better work ethics....even if it is just doing the dishes, and taking out the garbage and what not. Younger people need this so when they do go out on their own they know that work rewards. Otherwise, really...Welfare works too! An allowance only has to be small, not including clothes and stuff. Just for personal possesion wantings. It also incurages saving money.
One day when we all grow up we will have to earn a living. What a shame!
I also think people that so totally believe that pirating is so horribly bad. Are doing it more than the rest, though just trying to make themselves sound better...Or more honest.
Everyone cheets!
Everyone!

 

I completely disagree. Pirating is theft. It is illegal and morally wrong. I don't pirate software/music/movies any more than I walk into a shop and help myself to goods without paying for them. Which I should say, I don't do.

Piracy, and p2p networks that thrive on distributing copyrighted material do do damage to the people who own that copyright. Their material is distributed without them receiving anythign for the thousands of hours of work that went into it. That is not justifiable. Just because software can be pirated easily over these networks does not make it ok, and just because a lot of other people do it does not make it right either.

 

hi dudes,
when i first got in to computers years back.
and cd-rewriters were the in thing to have.
somebody who i worked with (not me i may add).
was copying software like...
3dmax-poser-cakewalk,winxp pro, office 2000,
And was selling any disc any program for £5 pounds and even had the front to advertise in the local newspaper as you can imagine he did get caught.
up to that point he had never had so much as a parking ticket.
he got investagated by c.i.d and f.a.c.t.
this was his first offence he got two years in a uk prison and was told by the judge let this be an example to anybody else (made an example of).
all this for a little pocket money.
stealing is stealing whichever way you dress it up i know some companys charge a fortune for software but hey.
you'd pay a plumber to fix your busted boiler and a mechanic to fix your car so whats the difference with software programs use somebodys else hardwork then you pay for that prevelige.

 

hi just reading what jazzgood has said.
i'm no saint i have been a kid too.
i now have kids of my own(4) but i do check on what programs they are using as thats my job as a parent but if we as adults dont set any rules and good morals for our younger generation then who will.
i want a new rolls royce but it dont mean i will nick cause i can.
all kids need a break.
life is as tough as its always been.
those who have done nothing wrong have done nothing.
passing on knowledge to others of your mistakes is experience(preacher dude)
take care

 

Hang on. I don't think anyone was laying into anyone else. We were simply trying to tell kevmcq7 to stop whinging (because that's what he was doing, no doubt about that).

Besides, piracy is theft. It isn't a victimless crime like most people take it to be. The victims are the content publishers themselves. If you went to rob your local blockbuster, for instance, the victim would be that store (it's just lost a rental copy of a film/game/whatever) but overall the content creators will not lose out.

With piracy you now own the material - so you won't want to rent or buy it from anyone - which means the content creator has lost out on a sale.

Also, nobody on this board has the right to question someone elses parents decision. They made the decicision, for ill or good, and that's it. As an external viewer you have no right whatsoever to go disputing it. You have no idea what the context of the family is, their history, their health, their employment, their residence - so anything you say is going to be inappropriate. This goes for all the forums, too. You don't have the right to preach good parenting to people who want to put keyloggers on their children's computers, for example, either.

*sigh* nothing like a friday morning rant

 

No, not everone cheats. And I'll leave it at that.

 

Everyone here who read the rules knows our stance, so there isn't much left to discuss on it.